What freedoms do you not have ?

Apparently, these pathetic underachievers do not have the freedom to block legal access to public property by other citizens....and that, of course, is just as it shiuld be. Go, Boston Police!

Took a quote straight from the British Red Coat ideology. How odd that some "Americans" can chastize other Americans for exercising their constitutional right.

Remember, it was "underachievers" as these who initiated our War for Independence from the Crown; in this case, the Corporate Masters.

JK - it is not their constitutional right to trespass and destroy property. Sad you can't recognize the obvious.

"We're all feeling helpless right now," protester Ryan Cahill said on the Occupy Boston live stream, the Globe reported. "The spirituality tent is being torn down."

What?!?!?!? You've got to be kidding! Spirituality comes from within, not from a tent! If enforcing the law makes you feel helpless, you've got real problems.

Willowbrook is correct in stating that the OWS protesters do not have the right to destroy property owned/paid for by others...whether the "others" are private individuals or public entities.

If you believe that your freedoms or liberties are somehow controlled by the "they" in Jimmy Neutron's comments, you can try living in some places like Somalia, China, Iran, etc...Our system may not be perfect and beautiful, but it sure beats some of the alternatives.

And if you are so opposed to the Wallstreet/corporate world, I would like to see you be totally self-sufficient for just one week...start by making your own clothes, build your own shelter from lumber, cloth, windows, paint, etc, that you have manufactured yourself. Heat/cool your shelter with power that you provide for yourself. Then try supplying all of your own food, walk everywhere you need to go, stop using your computers, TV's, cell phones, don't go to the movies or the mall for your entertainment and shopping pleasures.

If you are not part of the solution, you are a part of the problem...protesting by occupying property that you don't own is not a solution...a solution comes from coming together in a group and bringing your recommendations for change to the people that you feel are creating the problem. Don't be surprised if are met with scorn, disbelief, and laughter. The people who fought for our freedom as a new country were not immediately accepted. Things worth having are worth difficult struggles to achieve.

If you do not like being removed from property you do not own by the local police, stop occupying the property. When you occupy said properties, the money for paying the police to remove you and cleaning up the aftermath of your protest comes from the pockets of the people you claim to represent...you know, the common taxpayers like me.

To me the OWS people are no better than the people and entities they protest against...I have seen no recommendations from them that would truly help this country...they just keep wasting my tax dollars. Granted, I lost patience with this whole thing about 2 weeks after it started, so I may have missed something important, but I doubt it because there's not been any big hoopla in the media

OWS had no goals and they achieved them. Next.

I guess if you're expecting people to let you break any law you want without repercussion, than no you don't have any freedom. You obviously have no idea just how good we have it, try going to hundreds of places around the world and then tell me you have limited freedoms...what a joke,

JK from PA, forgive them for they know not what they do. GO OWS ! these are the ones that are sacrificing there time, educations and at times there safety to show how corrupt this country has become. Kudos to the protesters !

Apache, it's the inequity of it all we're talking here my friend. This is not a comparison.

Well said McJ

I'm sick and tired those backed-union-socialist-comunist protesters with the 30% in favor believe they represent me and the other 59 % . They do not represent me, nor my values , nor my politic view.

McJ - WELL SAID! It is sad to see people that live in a country that affords it's people the greatest degree of feedom on the face of the earth act like they live in Cuba or Vietnam. Chuck Tillinghast, the OWS are not the ones that have brought this nation it's freedom, it's the soldiers and folks that have shed blood to ensure our freedoms and way of life; which, but the way, a large percentage of the OWS people want to tear down. I have NO sympathy for them, and if they, or YOU, break the law I toally support locking you up until you see the light or have a brain transplant.

@McJ-1747943......very well said!

"We're all feeling helpless right now," protester Ryan Cahill said on the Occupy Boston live stream, the Globe reported. "The spirituality tent is being torn down."

There is no spirituality among atheists other than a pipe.

What freedoms do you not have ?

The freedom to break the law, to do whatever they want, whenever they want, no matter who else's freedoms they have to step on to do it.

That's the most important thing to these losers.

Anarchy and fascism.

OWS is OVER !!

The only people who don't think it's over are the delusional bottom 1% who don't want it to be over, because now they have nothing to do, but smoke pot, eat hot pockets and sit on mommy & daddy's old couch in the basement.

You obviously don't understand whatt real democracy looks like. As for "hippies", you don't understand that 60's movement as well and what the crux of the protests were. If you check history their was a war goinng on in Southeast Asia, yeas, another failed war with catastrophic results, not unlike the Iraq War on false premises.

Remember Watergate, not dissimilar to domestic spying due to the failed Homeland Secuirty program under Bush and now Obama. But of course, if you like Wall Street shenanigans and their cause for the tanking of our economy, or are just unread and ill-informed, a statement like yours is expected.

When I read comments like yours I am reminded of Germany in the 30's and what led to WWII and the decimation of Europe because the German people were too ignorant and afraid to question authority, But, authority and the chain of commonad is what the right wing follows because it is afraid of the grey area and likes life packaged in black and white without thought of consequence.

Chuck Tillinghast

"JK from PA, forgive them for they know not what they do. GO OWS ! these are the ones that are sacrificing there time, educations and at times there safety to show how corrupt this country has become. Kudos to the protesters !"

Sacrifice time? what a sacrifice. Time is free unless you are one of the 99% that idiots whine about.

So what are you protesting? That you got a college education with government loads and can't get a job because the education you chose was worthless? Or you are protesting that illegal aliens should be taken care of by others taxes (since you don't pay any)? Or maybe you are just protesting that you are lazy but deserve to be taken care of by those who work?

Tell me, did your parents ever deny you anything, and do you still live with them? Ever been able to get a job because you actually had a usable skill other than flipping burgers?

Enquiring minds want to know.

It is unbelievable to me that there are people in this country that are not outraged by the treatment OWS is receiving. Maybe it is ignorance of the constitution that causes this reaction

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

This is a given right and OWS and other organizations are using it. Those of you siding with the police are, in fact, rolling over. You are letting your rights be walked over.

However, a peaceful demonstration does not get in the way of the public. They should not block a sidewalk, a subway entrance, a park entrance, a bridge, or a road; but they have the right to assemble peacefully.

> If you check history their was a war goinng on in Southeast Asia, yeas, another failed war with catastrophic results, not unlike the Iraq War on false premises.

Actually they were real American patriots. They got us out of that terrible war…a war we’d still be in if up to the Pentagon.

----USMC/USN, First Marine Division, I-Corps Vietnam, 1967-68

Come on people we are a free country. We're free to say what the gov't says we can say. We're free to have what the gov't says we can have. We're free to go where the gov't says we can go. We're free to do what the gov't says we can do. Coming soon...we're free to think what the gov't says we can think. Ahhh the smell of freedom never smelled so sweet.

‘If Conservatives are Smarter than Socialists, Why are they Losing?’
Source: JB Williams - (12/9/11)

Are you sure there are two competing sides in the American battle for freedom and liberty? Or are those two sides in the battle pushing towards the same end?

The progressive left in America is openly selling socialism now, openly selling Americans the notion that freedom doesn’t work. They are no longer operating in the shadows, but rather right up in your face. However, does the so-called “resistance” have any different end agenda? If they are selling “democracy,” they too are selling socialism! WAKE UP!

Our Founding Fathers did not form a democracy and for very good reason. As Thomas Jefferson explained, Democracy is mob rule, wherein 51% of the people can vote to take away the rights of the other 49%. When 51% of Americans no longer pay income taxes, guess how they will vote and where does that leave the other 49%, the taxpayers?

The father of socialism, Karl Marx, told us that “Democracy is the road to socialism.” Fact is—pure democracy is socialism. “Democratic Socialists believe that both the economy and society should be run democratically—to meet public needs, not to make profits for a few. To achieve a more just society, many structures of our government and economy must be radically transformed through greater economic and social democracy so that ordinary Americans can participate in the many decisions that affect our lives.”

So, how can you tell the difference between false opposition and real resistance? For starters, anyone promoting “democracy” as opposed to our Founders “Constitutional Representative Republic” is false opposition. They may create the illusion of opposing socialism, but by promoting “democracy” they are in fact promoting socialism. If the word democracy comes out of their mouth every time they talk about America, they are NOT a “constitutional conservative.”

Marx referred to the common people as the proletariat. “The proletariat is that class in society which lives entirely from the sale of its labor power and does not draw profit from any kind of capital; whose weal and woe, whose life and death, whose sole existence depends on the demand for labor…” – In America, intended to be a classless society of individuals free to self-govern, this working class group was labeled the “middle class.”

Under communist, socialist, Marxist, fascist, otherwise known as totalitarian concepts, the working class or proletariat is to have so-called control over all aspects of society including the economy and property rights. Of course, they do not have actual control, because in order to seize control they must institute excessive government powers to control it all on their behalf.

How many times over the last few years have we heard politicos argue over whether our despotic Federal Government is communist or fascist? Are the people having this debate unaware of the fact that communism and fascism are the same thing?

Our Founding Fathers knew that totalitarianism under all of its modern progressive labels is the opposite of freedom. Freedom and liberty are based solely upon individual rights as opposed to the collective rights of any group.

Communism is fascism and fascism is communism. So why are people debating which despotic form of totalitarianism has gripped our nation? Are they ignorant of history, or are they a false opposition busy muddying the water for those who would otherwise become serious resisters to both?

America has four kinds of enemies today…

1. Foreign enemies that have had their sights on American sovereignty and supremacy since the day our Declaration of Independence was written in 1776.
2. An overt enemy within, a Fifth Column sympathetic to foreign enemies and operating within our own government, political parties, media, academia and entertainment industry.
3. A covert enemy operating as false opposition under the guise of resisters, with the same end agenda as the enemies above.
4. The useful idiot, who means well but is just as dangerous, dumbed down beyond the point of recognizing and understanding even the most fundamental truths. This is the proletariat…who know not, what they do.

All four types of enemies must be confronted in order to save our Constitutional Representative Republic.

In any society, the commoners, the workers, will greatly outnumber the elites, the business owner, the corporate executive, professionals, the investors and entrepreneurs. In a Constitutional Representative Republic, every individual has equal right of self-determination. But in a democracy, the mob will rule over the minority and the masses have the power to take away individual rights for the “greater good” of the collective community. This is also known as socialism and in its extreme, communism.

For over a hundred years, America has fed more than 80% of the nations in the world, as those nations experimented with varying forms and degrees of socialism or outright communism. Today, that nation that once fed the world will soon no longer be able to feed itself.

Instead of spreading freedom and liberty around the globe so that nations could learn to one day feed themselves, America has adopted the concept of democracy and socialism from abroad. The very things our Founding Fathers separated from in 1776 now have a death grip on America a brief 235 years later.

In terms of political ideologies and government design, at the extreme left is communism/fascism – and at the extreme right is total freedom, also known as anarchy, or a completely lawless society.

America has the perfect balance for a maximum degree of individual freedom and liberty within the boundaries of an organized and civilized society—a Constitutional Representative Republic, if we can find a way to keep it.

A Constitutional Representative Republic is a form of self-governance.

This concept begins with individual rights, under Natural Law, the Laws of Nature, known as The Law of Nations, in which each individual has the freedom and liberty to govern their own lives. That idea is followed by the design for a government system of, by and for the people, which is very limited in scope and power to the functions, assigned it by the people and their sovereign states, via the U.S. Constitution.

The U.S. Constitution is not an enumeration of the people’s rights. It is a compact (or contract) between the people, the states and our Federal Government, assigning certain specific and limited powers to the Federal Government for benefit of the people and the states.

Our Bill of Rights is not an enumeration of the people’s rights. It is a list of protections for the people and their states, against the eventuality of a bloated and overbearing Federal Government which begins to act at odds with its people and their states.

The greatest threat to our Constitution and Representative Republic today is the sad fact that most Americans no longer know anything of their history. They are therefore, ill-equipped to protect the future of freedom and liberty.

Being forever vigilant requires knowing what we are to be forever vigilant about, and how to be forever vigilant. If you don’t know or respect the Constitution, you cannot protect the Constitution. If you don’t know your rights, you cannot protect your rights. If you know what to do but lack the intestinal fortitude to do it, then your nation is also doomed.

Who will save America?

It won’t be our foreign enemies, our enemies operating with our own government, media, academia and entertainment, our enemies running false opposition under the guise of a resistance, or even the useful idiots too dumbed down to know the vital difference between democracy and a Constitutional Representative Republic.

Combined, these four categories of enemies now make up a majority in America. It reminds me of a column I published in October of 2006, When 51-49 Becomes 49-51. The column warned of reaching the point of no return in America, when the proletariat not paying income taxes in America would outnumber American taxpayers, and forever thereafter, vote to enslave American taxpayers to support their notions of a greater good. There is no good on earth greater than freedom!

Democracy is socialism… It no longer requires any imagination to figure out what is happening in the systematic dismantling of America via Democratic Socialism, often referred to today as progressivism.

People, who attack freedom and liberty in the name of a greater communal good, are not constitutionalists.

People, who attack economic freedom and liberty by attacking free-market capitalism, are not American.

While we’re at it, social justice is the exact opposite of real justice under the equal application of law. It picks favorites and uses the power of government to destroy some Americans for benefit of other Americans.

People selling democracy are selling socialism, plain and simple. They will deny it, because they either know it, or don’t know it. But the truth never changes despite the denials. Marx, Stalin, Lenin, Hitler – they all knew it. Many Americans don’t…

Will the Tea Party save this nation? Many in the Tea Party are false opposition, pretenders and profiteers. Many others simply don’t know any better. All are as dangerous to America as the progressive socialists on the left they claim to oppose.

Look no further than the current use of modern history text books used in American public schools today, written by lifelong communist Howard Zinn, who often referred to himself as a libertarian.

Zinn was a radical playwright, teacher, anti-war activist and self-proclaimed historian. He was also a member of the Communist Party who wrote history books now used in American public schools. The common thread in today’s libertarian movement is its anti-war stance and anti-war protesters like Adam Kokesh, Code Pink and MoveOn.org .

The point is this – the lines between friend and foe has been intentionally and purposefully blurred. We are not just fighting the enemies we can all see, we are also fighting enemies who look and speak just like us. Between 2008 and 2010, even Obama and Pelosi learned Tea Party talking points.

It wasn’t honest constitutional conservatives who came up with the star fish insanity that all American patriots should work in twenty-thousand competing factions so that no real resistance could ever build across the nation. That notion was planted in the Tea Party movement by people intending to keep all of those competing factions divided and impotent.

Do you even have the intellectual honesty to ask yourself the right questions anymore?

Why are Romney, Bachmann, Paul and Huntsman running from a GOP debate in front of mega-capitalist Donald Trump? They can’t buy this kind of campaign opportunity for any amount of money. So why are these candidates running from Trump? They want the job of confronting the world’s most vicious enemies, but can’t face the Donald? Why didn’t they have the same opposition to debating in front of known leftist network progressives on numerous occasions? Why are these candidates friendlier towards leftist media personalities than successful businessman Donald Trump? What are they afraid of?

Corporations didn’t run this country into the ground, our federal government did. So, why are so-called libertarians masquerading as conservatives, attacking corporate America, where private sector employment is created?

Whose side are they really on, the private sector or the public sector? There is no in-between… Everyone opposes criminal activity. Nobody in their right mind would defend criminal enterprise – but the biggest criminal enterprise in America today is not corporate America, it is our Federal Government.

By the way, a constitutionalist saying that Article II isn’t worthy of utmost concern is akin to a Christian saying the New Testament isn’t worthy. If you don’t care about Article II, what parts of the Constitution do you care about?

This is the reality that must set in with every American patriot before they will be able to mount any real resistance to the ongoing dismantling of America.

An easy tell for friend or foe is if one promotes democracy vs. a Constitutional Representative Republic… attacks free-market capitalism or the runaway Federal Government dismantling America at breakneck speed…?

Before we can confront our many enemies, we must first know who they are. And then we must unite and fight together against all of them, or we will lose the battle for freedom and liberty and we will lose it very soon. That loss will come at a price unimaginable to most Americans.

Think it can’t happen here? Think it isn’t happening right in front of your eyes? WAKE UP PEOPLE!

Our enemies have a hundred-year head start and they are not only smart, they are devious.

Unless the American patriot is smarter and more committed to winning than our enemies, we will lose. We are already past the point of turning this thing around via national elections. Soon, we will be past the point of being able to save our own states, much less the nation.

WAKE UP! Rely on no one to educate you, educate yourself! Begin with understanding that passive resistance is not resistance at all. Resistance requires ACTION!

Then, unite with others who get it and stop wasting time and resources on people who will never get it, or get it too late.

Democracy is socialism, dummy. Talk of our “democracy” should throw up big red flags, no matter what room you are in at the time or who else is there with you.

To defeat socialism in America, you will have to defeat it in all its forms under all of its modern labels. You can’t do it alone, nobody can. Get in the game! Nobody can afford to sit this one out!

JB Williams

MF Global lost BILLIONS and that includes the 1.2 Billion they stole from clients. Their CEO says "I don't know where the money is" and he goes home to his family and these protesters go to jail? Corzine destroyed many families lives and yet he is out enjoying his life and we have protesters in jail? There is something wrong here.

or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Oh gee, what a shock that you would "interpret" the Constitution the way you want it interpreted to fit your narrative.

There are laws against where you can peaceably assemble. So by your interpretation, 50 of my friends and I can camp out of your front lawn?? I bet you call the cops within the first hour. Why? We have the right to peacefully assemble. OH!! Just not on your front lawn??

Why can't we?, because there are laws against doing that, that's why.

You have the Freedom of Speech too, but if you vocally threaten the President of the United States you can be arrested and charged with a felony, because it's against the law to threaten the President, freedom of speech or not.

Funny how "The Right to Bear Arms" is in the Constitution, but the left continually screams for tighter and more restrictive gun LAWS !!!

Where do you get off calling other people ignorant??

Bob,

If you're going to write that much, just right your own article or blog. Nobody has time to read that long of a "comment." Just a suggestion. Have a nice day :)

Well said, cleansweeper. I mean, I can get a bit wordy but Bob's post is way too long.

And you have a good day, too, :)

Just posted it. I didn't write it. And if no one has the time to read it, then they don't need to be free either.

Our country is being lost because too many are being lazy and don't care. The Old Testament was filled with those who didn't care. That is why God kept punishing them.

Speaking of the Old Testament, most are too lazy to read it too. Same with the New Testament. Western civilization was originally based on it, but over the years people got lazy and decided to ignore what is right and wrong.

I can no longer remember who said this, but it is absolute truth. " No democracy can survive as a form of government. As soon as the voting public learn they can vote themselves perks from the public treasury, they will always vote for the candidate who promises the most perks. That government will soon collapse on it's own fiscal mismanagement, and is always followed by a dictatorship."

Read history - every democracy, including constitutional republics, have failed. And all were followed by a dictatorship. The united states has lasted longer than most, but is on the road to collapse.

Camping out downtown is NOT a legal right! And these people should be required to pay for the damage they did to public property.

In favor of political correctness, which is just a lazy version of stupid.

Boo hoo, oh boo hoo, why oh why do I have to suffer any discomfort to have my freedoms?

Yes oldman, people are too stupid to govern themselves. Democracy always fails, the only things that have worked are the magna carta and the american constitution, democracy is whittling away at them.

oldman young eyes

"I can no longer remember who said this, but it is absolute truth. " No democracy can survive as a form of government. As soon as the voting public learn they can vote themselves perks from the public treasury, they will always vote for the candidate who promises the most perks. That government will soon collapse on it's own fiscal mismanagement, and is always followed by a dictatorship."

Read history - every democracy, including constitutional republics, have failed. And all were followed by a dictatorship. The united states has lasted longer than most, but is on the road to collapse."

Funny that you say that since America is the first and longest lasting constitutional republic that all others try to improve on but fail. And the only reason America will fail is because to many want to believe it is supposed to be a democracy, which it was never supposed to be. AKA 2 wolves and a sheep deciding what is for dinner. Fortunately for the sheep, there is the second amendment. Two bad the real sheep trying to destroy America have no clue because the never cared to check it out.

Btw, I am an old man too. Also have disabled parking permit because I am lame. lol

Bob, Thanks for the post. If only people would take the time to read Mr. William's very thought provoking assessment, then there would be less division and more attention focused in the right direction. Unfortunately for Mr. Williams, too many people are too lazy to learn. We live in an impatient society that like to be told by authoritarians what to believe. Our country needs a revolution by MODERATES, who understand the extremes of the left or right do not represent America. The majority of our nation has always been moderate, but it seems as lately that extremism is running wild.

Bob,

Cut and pasting an article rather than write your own comments is the epitome of laziness / stupid

Oldman we are not going to let the democracy collapse even the forces of the left want it to , the anarchist that complaint about freedom but do not care about the freedom and rights of the others.

Boy ignorance is bliss.

There are laws against where you can peaceably assemble. So by your interpretation, 50 of my friends and I can camp out of your front lawn?? I bet you call the cops within the first hour. Why? We have the right to peacefully assemble. OH!! Just not on your front lawn??

With my permission, yes you can. You fail to understand. We have the right as long as it is done legally. I am part of a political organization. When we peacefully assemble, we do it legally, we do not block sidewalks, etc.

Where I live, Occupy is camping on public land, they are keeping it clean, they left wide walkways for people to pass by. The police have no reason to bother them so they don't. Oh, they are right in the middle of downtown. They march every Saturday at Noon. All legal, no problems.

bob3374873: You are a piece of work, I have never read such BS in my life. go back to your trailer park.

The Police State can knock down the camps, they can arrest those who work to free the sheep but they will not destroy Occupy movement. They will be back they will continue showing the sheep the wrongs and total pure evil of the Bankers and the republican'ts and teabaggers.

The Corporate media can continue to ignore the reason the Occupy people protest which is opposition to filthy rich investors, bankers and big businesses too big to fail. The Corporate Media can continue to censure the occupy movement, they can continue to carry out a blackout against them but they will never smash the spirit of the Occupy Movement and the occupy movement's message is getting out even now, with-out the help of corporate media.

I am proud to support the 99%

And of course all of this is my opinion

I don't know, nor care, what they're trying to say but whatever it is, they have the right to say it. The criminals are the cops and mayors that are preventing them.

Huskergal

As long as they are doing it legally there is no problem, but OWS is camping in public parks, which is NOT legal.

Bob! Good job and completely relevant. Loved the post and will save that for future reference. Good references and outline of concepts. Great comparison of Democracy vs Republic. Thank you!

tontosh-2444879

MF Global lost BILLIONS and that includes the 1.2 Billion they stole from clients. Their CEO says "I don't know where the money is" and he goes home to his family and these protesters go to jail? Corzine destroyed many families lives and yet he is out enjoying his life and we have protesters in jail? There is something wrong here

tonthosh,

You are right.

How can the Big-Wig thieves continue to walk free, and those that are fighting for economic justice get arrested and locked up? If we do not have Democracy here, how can we tell the "oppressed" in other countries to fight for freedom? In a high-minded strut the guilty walk free. The lowly protesters are in the slammer. You are right something is wrong. The swat-team raids on the Occupy Wall Street demonstrations will not stop people's dream for economic, political and social fairness.

The ignorant here are masochistic and pathetic!

This to Steve in reference to Look at my Castle.What freedoms don't you have Stevo?Why don't you start looking at the airports for starters, from there go to train stations, bus stations,and even on the highways.If your rights aren't being interfered with yet, they sure as hell will be in the very near future.Example on the highway the Fuching TSA have got check points out on the highways of Tennesee.These Aholes can pull you over any dam time they well please without any reason.Think I'm kidding.Type in TSA and Tennessee Highways.This is a trial run,and it is going to spread to all the States.

THEY'RE CALLED YOUR 4TH AMENDMENT RIGHTS BEING SH ITTED ON!

Then there's A Hole Obama's Healthcare Fiasco, FORCING YOU TO BUY INSURANCE.Mandated is what it's called.You cannot force anyone to buy anything.

Then there's Secret Sessions going on in WASHINGTON to pass a bill where the Military or your local police can barge into your house take you out and JAIL YOU WITH NO CHARGES AND KEEP YOU THERE INDEFINITELY,WITH OUT A LAWYER OR A TRIAL.

I got that information in an EMail last week from the ACLU.

In fact in Indiana that rule about the police barging into your house for no real reason with no warrant, that's been in effect for about a year now.

All this sh it that I'm writting about has never ever happened in the United States of America before.IT ORIGINALLY WAS AGAINST THE LAW AND THE CONSTITUTION AND THE BILL OF RIGHTS.

SO WAKE UP STEVO,YOU AND MILLIONS OF AMERICANS ARE ABOUT TO GET SHI TTED ON AND HAVE QUITE A FEW OF YOUR CIVIL RIGHTS ABOLISHED.STOP SLEEPING!

So Steve that's where your Freedoms are going.No longer the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, this country has turned into the UNITED POLICE STATES OF AMERICA.

.

tontosh....

you left out those who steal, rape, assault and murder who also deny their own accountability for their actions. Congress can't prosecute corzine, however the DOJ can and obama is the head of the DOJ.

BTW - seems that over the years criminals and lawbreakers have far more rights than the victims they do damage to. Seems to me that that is the real travesty.

Boy ignorance is bliss.

There are laws against where you can peaceably assemble. So by your interpretation, 50 of my friends and I can camp out of your front lawn?? I bet you call the cops within the first hour. Why? We have the right to peacefully assemble. OH!! Just not on your front lawn??

With my permission, yes you can.

Holy sh!t are you an idiot.

And you call me ignorant??

You just proved and agreed with my argument !!!

With my permission, yes you can.

EXACTLY !! With your PERMISSION, but if we don't have your permission IT'S ILLEGAL !!

Do you even know where Dewey Square is in Boston?? It isn't a "park". It's a small patch of lawn between two busy streets in downtown Boston and ends by the South Street station, which is a heavily traffic area for people trying to get to WORK !! I know, I used to live in Boston and I walked right through that area everyday on my way to work.

Nobody gave these morons PERMISSION to set up tents, they just did it you doofuss.

Nobody gave the OWS in New York PERMISSION to set up tents in Zuccotti Park. Which is a privately owned park.

You're not only delusional, you ignore the truth and reality, because it doesn't jive with your entitled mentality and idiotic ideology.

@ Magnum Serpentine - if you support the 99% then you do not support OWS. OWS are out of touch with reality and are being manipulated by the Unions and the far left. The very people who have put us in the predicament we are in right now. Is that what you support?

Lets face it Liberalism is Socialism/Communism, Americas long time Enemy, if these misguided individuals succeed in their quest to stomp on corporate America, destroy free enterprise, and undermine the foundations of capitalism, and handing your free choice over to a government entity, what will become of America, what will happen to your chances of achieving the American dream, how will you be able to at least try to rise above your present financial situation with the weight of Socialism on your back, you won't you will simply be one of the masses, a pawn that can be sacrificed for the good of the many, told what to do and when to do it (sheeple) reporting to your masters and jumping through bureaucratic hoops to get your entitlement check while the working class is enslaved to pay those entitlements and no chance of bettering yourself. Corporate America will suffer a set back in production and profit, Ceo's will not be motivated to do their jobs, and like Socialism has proved time after time will fail and in the process destroy this Nation, the machine will stop running. the money will stop flowing, inflation will soar people wont work, Medical will be a serious problem with less to work with and every one in line to be seen by some medical practitioner. the masses all waiting in line for this or that, simple things like toilet paper a rationed luxury. wake up people the Liberals have been working on us and brain washing our youth for half a century, look at entertainment (Avatar the Moppets) all politically themed for the left, its brain washing children to fill their ranks, our college professors teaching their opinions instead of teaching the curriculum. why do they do this? because they have their personal pet peeve and want it their way, they believe they are right and everyone else is wrong, they think they should control everything, and run your life because they don't think you can handle it. apparently in some cases they are right, but in other cases they are living in a dream world. take the volatility out of the formula (the 1%) and you have no formula just a cup of water and no cup. the Truth is if corporate America goes down we all go down, our government is the problem not wall street, our universities need to cap the mouths of liberal opinionated professors using campuses for a political backdrop for Socialist (propaganda) reform. the truth is if America was to embrace Socialism and allow it, in less than 20 years we would all be better off dead.

We (the American people as Republicans, Democrats and independents) need to promote a constitutional amendment banning all non governmental financing of elections.

That should be something the overwhelming majority of us can agree on.

Protest in DC by all means, but this problem is happening at all levels of our government, and is literally being paid for by these huge multinational corporations.

This can't be done without the American public coming together, put our other differences aside. The effort can't be led by politicians because their political opponents would then be funded by the corporations.

OWS and the Tea party started partly as a reaction to the corruption the current corporate election system has wrought . The reason the Banks not only were bailed out, but the reason they needed to be bailed out was because the banks have been able to rewrite the rules they do business under.

The reason we can spend trillions on wars, but only millions on cancer research, or education, or infrastructure or anything that would benefit those of us here at home, is because military contractors and oil companies (who don't want to spend their own money on security in risky nations) spend taxpayer money on electing people who will keep certain conflicts going that stand to improve their bottom lines.

Conservatives, liberals, and moderates are all being screwed by this problem.

“While Occupy Boston protesters may be exercising their expressive rights during the protest, they have no privilege under the First Amendment to seize and hold the land on which they sit’’ -- Official Court ruling by Suffolk Superior Court Judge Frances McIntyre

Glad to see Mayor Menino finally had the guts to follow through on it. If you think we live in a police state because the law prohibits you from seizing and causing the destruction of other people's property, then you are delusional.

Well, someone figure out how Bush or those dumb ass Texas are behind this.

Feeedome is just another word for nothin left to loose......Yea, Yea, yea, me and my Bobby Mcgee.

You All remember how that ended, don't ya?

If you're going to quote Janis, at least know how to spell the word lose. Thank you.

This site should limit posts to about 500 words or less. Then we wouldn't get so many dissertations, like Bob's.

Anyone who believes making the rich richer will make them richer too is f#$%ed in the head. History has repeatedly shown that a prosperous middle class is what makes everyone richer, including the rich.

…Several new studies have offered further evidence that these two problems are getting worse and, perhaps more importantly, that a large portion of the population is concerned about these issues.

Growing income inequality. Few reports in recent memory packed quite as much of a bang in so few words as one from the Congressional Budget Office.

The report shows that between 1979 and 2007, the superrich -- people in the top 1% of wage earners -- saw their after-tax incomes nearly triple, while those in the bottom 20% saw their wages remain relatively flat during that nearly 30-year period. As if that weren't infuriating enough, the CBO's report showed that the top 20% of wage earners saw their share of the nation's overall income increase by 10 percentage points during that period, while the other 80% saw their share decline by 2 or 3 percentage points.

In just a few paragraphs, the CBO showed definitively that the rich are getting richer at the expense of everyone else.

Americans favor wealth redistribution. Given the increasing degree of income inequality, it should come as little surprise that most Americans would echo those protesters who argue the current distribution of wealth is unfair.

One recent survey from The New York Times found that two-thirds of Americans believe U.S. wealth distribution is unfair, with a whopping 86% of Democrats saying so and 67% of independents. Republicans were less likely to agree with this statement, but nearly half still feel the distribution is not fair.

That may not mean two-thirds of the country would be willing to march in the cold weather to change this fact, but it does seem to put the burden of proof on those who claim the status quo is just fine.

Even the wealthy want to pay more taxes. One might assume that those with the most to lose would be the ones to fight hardest against evening out the income disparities, but a survey from Spectrem Group suggests otherwise.

The survey found that the vast majority (68%) of people worth at least $1 million favor raising taxes on Americans who make more than $1 million. And 61% of those worth at least $5 million are in favor of doing so. In other words, even the wealthy are fine with raising taxes on the wealthy, and previous surveys have shown that most average Americans certainly are in favor of it. So that really just leaves legislators inside the Beltway as the real hurdle.

No one likes the government, and few trust it. Perhaps for this reason, there seems to be a growing disconnect between the American people and the federal government that reflects the same sense of distrust heard among the protesters.

The same CBS News/New York Times poll found that just 9% of Americans approve of the current Congress and that 89% say they don't trust government to do what's right. Likewise, 70% say Republicans in Congress are pursuing policies that favor the wealthy.

"No coal for your fire, no candlelight to work by, and NO health insurance for Tiny Tim" -- Scrooge

"The American Dream? George Bailey, you and the 99% have "been a boil on my neck long enough" -- Henry F. Potter

I seem to recall a great american patriot saying something like, "I may not agree with what you say but I will fight to the death for your right to say it."

The great american patriots seem to be long gone.

Bob3374873

This is a constitutional republic. That means the "majority rules" and not the minority few through greed or holding the country hostage as the minority tea party has through the influence of the rich and powerfull Wall Street and the Koch brothers, Grover Norquist or other lobbyists. We are true Americans who believe in our Constitution and want to take this country back from the minority 1% who now have taken this contry hostage and stripping the citizens of their dignity and self respect by shipping their jobs overseas,stripping away their medical, the roof over their head, food on their table, their life long dream of retirement while the greedy 1% get richer on the backs of the majority.
The greedy 1% want to destroy our constitution also by turning control of the federal judicial system and Supreme Court over to congress. There was a reason our founding fathers separated the the three branches. It was to keep checks and balances of each other.

marklepew

"Bob,

Cut and pasting an article rather than write your own comments is the epitome of laziness / stupid"

So why don't you post something your wrote? The article I posted says it all.

daclhill

"Bob3374873

This is a constitutional republic. That means the "majority rules" and not the minority few through greed or holding the country hostage as the minority tea party has through the influence of the rich and powerfull Wall Street and the Koch brothers, Grover Norquist or other lobbyists. We are true Americans who believe in our Constitution and want to take this country back from the minority 1% who now have taken this contry hostage and stripping the citizens of their dignity and self respect by shipping their jobs overseas,stripping away their medical, the roof over their head, food on their table, their life long dream of retirement while the greedy 1% get richer on the backs of the majority.
The greedy 1% want to destroy our constitution also by turning control of the federal judicial system and Supreme Court over to congress. There was a reason our founding fathers separated the the three branches. It was to keep checks and balances of each other."

If you believe in the constitution, then you should at least read it. There is nothing in it that says America is a democracy. And if you really believe the majority should rule, the you would also agree that gay marriage should be banned in California, where the majority voted against it.

Majority rule is democracy. If the majority voted to remove all of your rights, how would you feel about that? That is democracy. You have no say in the federal government. You vote for a person to represent you and he decides the way he will vote for or against you.

Based on everything you said, you don't even want a democracy. You want others to give you something you haven't earned because you feel you deserve it, but you don't. Self respect and dignity are things that can't be legislated. Health care is not a right. And as for jobs going overseas, you asked for that by voting in people who allowed that to happen. You are also a direct supporter of overseas labor nearly every time you buy something. You want to pay less, but want those who do the work to get paid more. Can't have both.

The problem doesn't lay with businesses, but with those you elected who will do anything to get reelected. You are reaping what you have sown and now you are whining about it.

alan 290, your idea sounds good after a post like Bob's but that would infringe upon our freedoms, wouldn't it? Old Bob just came right back and posted another long post--and he calls us lazy for not reading a post he cut and pasted!! lol

Fellow viners, I am honored you felt the need to collapse my post #1.23 above. I'm a first-timer as far as collapsing--------must have hit a few nerves with our British "friends". lol Wonder if it was the sausage rolls or the soccer? The cold, dreary weather or stating that they have been coming and continue to come to our country to live, both legally or illegally. So many of them get away with it I am absolutely convinced the US govt. has a sweetheart deal with the UK. Oh, yeah, every now and then we round up some "illegals" but they always have some shade of brown skin, not pasty white like the Brits!!

Or perhaps it was the funny hats..........They are really touchy about those funny hats.

Happy Holidays! :)

Dammit. Once again Obama failed to fight for the 99% who OWS. Is there any chance that Obama was taught to defend the 1% at Harvard. Hope not. I voted for Obama in 2008. I am 65 and a lifelong Democrat just like my parents were since 1932. Wow. I go back a long way with the Democrats. How come I think Obama is the most spineless Demicrat I ever saw. Oh I know. He is Commander in Chief of the United States and he doesn't seem to think some of us are in economic trouble. My earliest memories of politics is my parents telling me that Social Security was a done deal. I am now 65 and receiving Social Security. Why do I still feel threatened by the loss of my income. Oh, Obama is the most spineless American I ever saw. Limbaugh said his was an uppity..... Jeepers, i never heard the next word because my parents didn.t use it. I was very glad as a child that racism in America was through. But sometimes when I hear Rush Limbaugh I suspect there may be a little racism left. I wonder why. How come Obama never visits black neighborhoods. I live near Newark NJ and would have liked to see Obama. How come Obama never heard of Newark. Lots of white people like me enjoy the new mayor of Newark by the name of Cory Booker. How come Booker has never been invited to the White House. Every Republican and rich guy in America isinvited to the White House. This is nice. Black people and white people have achieved equality. Obama doesn't like any of us no matter whate color we are. He does love the color of money doesn't he. Everyday my laptop is filled up with his sniveling pleas. Give me money and I will ignore everyone equally. Obama doesn't play favorites. He hates white people as much as he hates black people. Personally I now hate Obama. I wonder who will vote for him in 2012. I can't think of a single Democrat black or white, who likes Obama. Maybe he will get a big turnout by the Borg and the Klingons. Vulcans who graduated from Harvard may like Obama. I wonder why Democrats don't like Obama. I hope we elect a Republican with a sense of humor. That might be nice and a lot lot better than Obama. Goodbye Obama. You will make as much money as Bill Clinton as our first black President. Choke on the money Obama or shove it up your ass, You really are a disgrace Obama. I intend to end an 80 year commitment from family to the Democrats. I will vote for anyone buy you. You are spineless heterosexual faggot sissy. Have fun in hell, you low life. Run for office in Saudi Arabia that is where your real friends are. Slime bucket. How much does the Saudis pay you under the table to keep you on their side. You scuzzy bastard. I am glad I graduated from Parris Island. I think I saw you from the 500 yard line. I knew I wanted to shoot at my captors. They reminded me of the Saudis who hold my planet in captivity. Why don't the Israelis drop a nuclear bomb on Saudis. No one will attend their funeral. I bet it would end antisemitism forever. Everyone would think the Jews are pretty good guys if they wiped Saudi Arabia off the map. But Obama intends to defend the Saudis from Israel. Maybe Israel could drop a nuclear bomb on Washington. I don't want to go to their funerals either. Hey, Israel 2 stinking nuclear bombs could fix the world. Jimmy Carter said you have 150 nuclear bombs. If you use 2 nukes everyone will stop saying you are cheap. 2 nukes won't bankrupt Israel. Just steal 2 more from us. We ccould all live in peace in harmony. We could pretend Netanyahu was the messiah. He has a big ego. He would like to be the messiah. We don't get a messiah soon the whole world will go Kaput. Then we will get Hitler back. One Hitler was enough for me. I don't want to see another one. Let's be pro Zionist and pro Israel. Then we can urinate on Jewish liberals from New York City and shove the New York Times down their throat. How come only Jewish gentiles from Wall St and Beverly Hills evr get listened to. With so many normal Jews who behave like human beings, why do we tolerate Jewish liberals like Chuck Shumer. He is about as Jewish as Hitler if you ask me. Unfortunately I grew up in a Jewish neighborhood where Jews actually looked like Jews. They actually had senses of humor unlike Jewish liberals who only have money. When I was kid I thought all Jews had beards. Gentile Jews only have money and live in very fancy neighborhoods and where million dollar outfits. I miss the poor Jews I grew up with they were funny and nice to have as neighbors. You could always count on them to babysit your kid in a pinch. Jews no longer babysit even their own kids. They bring in illegal immigrants to watch over Jewish brats on Fifth Avenue and Rodeo Drive. I wish Jews still practiced Judaism it was a nice religion when I was a kid, But that was a long time ago in a city that no longer exists. It was called New York City back then. It is now called the BIg Apple and home to rich worms who eat from everyone's plate trying to get very fat. I wonder when New York City got taken over by sociopaths who despise every one on the planet. New York City was a beautiful city before Ed Koch pissed all over it pretending to be a liberal. I haven't seen a Jew with a beard o a yamulkah since I moved away from Yeshiva University in upper Manhattan. If there any jews left in America, Hi how are you. Tell your sociopath Jewish gentile cousins to move to Saudi Arabia. They would fit in better with Arabs than Israelis. that's for sure.

To spread joy & happiness this Christmas season to the tax paying citzens.

Its part of the OWS movement thats why

To show that our government can easily disrupt peaceful protest, the consititutional right of assembly. Also, to gauge the response of our citizenry. To date, the government can count on approximately 40% of American society to easily roll over and give up their civil liberties. We call them Republicans.

It is barely a story at all.

"We're all feeling helpless right now," protester Ryan Cahill said on the Occupy Boston live stream, the Globe reported. "The spirituality tent is being torn down."

Got an issue? Grab a tissue. You might want to add stupid to your "feelings".

It's not a movement and it never was. It was a chance for a bunch of unemployed losers to have a party at the expense of taxpayers. Americans tolerated these losers for a while but after property damage and violet crime there was plenty of support to shut them down...bye, bye!

cullerco...

I agree...or better, why does the media try to make this a bigger story than it is ?

In Connecticut earlier this week, the state's largest newspaper...the oldest continually published newspaper in the country...ran a banner headline and front page story about the capital city's OWS encampment being closed down by police.

There were 6 protesters at the encampment. Inside the mind of the editor of what is regarded as a fairly liberal newspaper...how exactly is that front page news ?

Occupy Park Bench needed intervention. It's getting cold and this gets the protestors off of their ideological hook and back indoors where it is warm and cozy. Have a toddy.

Encampments have served their purpose but the idea seems to continue on. So one might inquire what do these raids against citizens really accomplish?

In a word nothing.

Yes, they are unemployed and so are a lot of other people, which was sort of the point of the protest.

That said, carrying signs at rallies is one thing and squatting on public or private parks 24/7 and causing all kinds of problems is another. Whatever their cause their methods are very foolish, like shouting down reporters sent to interview them or disrupting a "Law and Order" filming that was probably going to be respectful to them. there is no potential supporter they won't chase off. Not soo smart of them.

Apache32 and Tony- "The mind is a wonderful thing, every one should have one! -------------------------- ------------------------You still need to get yours

-------- What is the SIGNIFICANCE of these Word-wide OWS demonstrations?------
Here are the Prophetic words by Tom Friedman, the famous journalist with “The New York Times” :
“Now let me say that in English: the European Union is cracking up. The Arab world is cracking up. China’s growth model is under pressure and America’s credit-driven capitalist model has suffered a warning [major] heart attack and needs a total rethink. Recasting any one of these alone would be huge. Doing all four at once — when the world has never been more interconnected - is mind-boggling.
--- We are again present at the creation - but of what?

-------- [ Never in the history of modern man has such a global event ever happened ] -----

As for America, we’ve thrived in recent decades with a “credit-consumption-led economy”, whereby we maintained a middle class by using more steroids (easy credit, subprime mortgages and construction work) and less muscle-building (education, skill-building and innovation). It’s put us in a deep hole, and the only way to dig out now is a new, hybrid politics that mixes spending cuts, tax increases, tax reform and investments in infrastructure, education, research [innovation] and production. But that mix is not the agenda of either party. Either our two parties find a way to collaborate in the center around this new hybrid politics, or a third party is going to emerge
-------— or we’re stuck and the pain will just get worse”.

[ Of the three demanded activities, education, skill-building and innovation, –- none is financially or otherwise supported by our present Government. --- This omission is an act of National-suicide.]

I'm watching the show "Alaska State Troopers" and I My head is spinning as I can't beleive that people in parts of Alaska are going to jail for drinking or having alcohol...

I can't believe how we bottom dwellers and the people of this nation allow for this government and law enforcement to dictate what you put in your body!!!!!
If you have a product that they dont like but you like, they will put you in in prison and treat you inhumanely for "YOUR RIGHT TO CHOOSE WHAT TO PLACE IN YOU"!!!!

WHEN GOVERNMENT HAS STRIPPEN AWAY YOUR RIGHT TO CHOOSE WHAT IS FOR YOU THEY MUST BE CONFRONTED!!!!

YA PEOPLE ARE CRAZY FOR LETTING THEM TELL YA WHAT TO DO.....

LIKE SOME LITTLE GIRLIES>...

JK... it's not about govt stopping peacful protest. It's about stopping illegal protest, they were trespassing. I'm all for people's right to protest and speak out, it's what makes our country great. There are plenty of places they could protest without trespassing. Just as we are a nation of free speech, we are also a nation of laws.

Watch the girl comments buster

I'm hopeful they can muster enough fortitude to keep some sort of presence until the elections, assuring the defeat of the Excuse-Maker-in-Chief and at least seven more GOP Senate seats. The silent 99% really hates whiners and crybabies. I'm hopeful, but not optomistic. These are losers, literally by definition.

You mean like have honor laws and legally pop a cap in their arm or leg? Or if you're really pissed, go "Aaron Burr" on their sorry @sses? I have no problems with shooting or using a rapier to poke holes in people who I feel have wronged me.

TTTTTT------Best post of the day, possibly the year. You have pretty much summed up the whole thing and anyone with any sense of reality can't help but see what you have posted as-----BOTTOM LINE

Bfront...my thoughts exactly! Sprituality tent?

Stupid should hurt!

Who needs a spirituality tent? Those things are over rated. They can smoke pot or shoot up heroin anywhere.

Mike Check!!....Mike Check!!

John, 5x5

this president of hope and change,is sucking the WHOLE country dry.transparent goverment,, what a joke, he has more dishonest back door deals then I have ever seen.where is this trillion dollar economic boost gone?that's million, million dollars for those that don't know what a trillion equals .which would of been 2000 million per state if divided /spent right. if each state had only half of that we would all be working and we would need even more illigal immigrants to help with all the jobs .WAKE UP IT"S YOUR PRESIDENT that is crooked.not the people that have took chances and worked long hours hard to make money that owe these free loaders anything ...think about it if you can think

Hey "Thou Shall" . Try reading up on the Nationalization of Germany in the early 1930's and how Hitler used class warfare to win popular support against the wealthy.

The Bolshevik Revolution much the same.

It will become clear the Swastika belongs on a Jackass, not the Fox logo.

.099%

mariondanna,

You are quite the critical person, aren't you? You yap a lot about what others are doing to try to change this fvcked up system, but WHAT HAVE YOU DONE? Thats right, you've just sat on your a$$ and played on your computer and did NOTHING! The Occupy Movement has at the very least brought the attention of the entire Nation to the way the majority is being trodden under by the minority and proclaimed "ENOUGH!". If you're not doing something thats even more effective at changing the status quo then at the very least SHUT UP while someone else is making THEIR efforts and give them some moral support while they try.

"Damned old Yankee ass hippies, Take them out!" are hardly the words of someone in the "choir". They are the words and sentiments of an enemy- I don't care if your income puts you in with the 99% or not. Its because the 1% get the support of people like YOU that things don't change. You AREN'T in the choir- you're in the gang that decides to sit next to the choir and blast punk rock from a boom box to interrupt the choir's performance. The old saying "With friends like you, who needs enemies?" was invented for people just like you.

Try this, mariondanna- present to everybody your perfect plan for getting the necessary changes done or at the very least remain silent while others make their own attempts- however imperfect. Or, even better, show them some support instead of back-stabbing their efforts.

Right Merlin. Boston Occupy lasted a LONG time, was peaceful and I think Menino showed more restraint than other mayors. So okay, let's deal with what we have. Occupy is doing other things like occupying foreclosed homes, occupying banksters by screaming at them. We must find other venues and must still give to the movement. DO NOT LET THOSE SWINE label us caving. The tea baggies allowed the ones who scr$w everyone to occupy them. Let's use the Democratic party because it is the ONLY path to power NOW as our vehicle for change...GET THE GD CONGRESS BLUE PROGRESSIVE. THINK if they were how much things would be better. Obama as critical as I am sometimes he had HUGE HUGE obstacles in an intractable, rancid, corrupt, sickening Republican party who appeals to the DOPES of the nation. We need to appeal to those who are SMART and have a better shot in the Democratic party.

MOST OF ALL do NOT let the DNC convention be ruined by violence or bad images...KEEP US ALIVE BY USING WHAT WE HAVE!!!

mariondanna, no matter what they do to us we’re not going away, and that sound that you hear is the sound of the 99% of the population fed up and sick and tired of the system and people like you,

They don't sound like 99% of the people I know, and I don't travel in particularly select circles.

They sound like vane theorists with a multiplicity of complaints, a simplified view of the world, and, more than anything, a deep conviction that if they shout loud enough, something will happen.

Their continued presence indicates there is a great deal of anger, fear and frustration in our society, but I've yet to see a clear statement of what it is these people are proposing. My impression is that they have no clear idea of what should change or how.

Sorry OWS - you do not represent the 99%, more like 9%. It is obvious to anyone with an IQ higher than 75 that OWS is a total failure. Continuing is an incredible waste of time and shows just how out of touch with reality you are.

You know, these aren't the 99%.

You guys need to get it straight. These are the bottom 9% that are willing to screw the 90% to get back at the 1%.

Why anybody supports this crybaby cause is absolutely beyond me.

The reason there are no liberals posting on here is because they are all at the OWS camp trying to change your pitiful excuse for a government because 50% of the 99% are either too lazy to help or too stupid to know there is anything wrong. And 25% of the 50% think they are rich if they are living in a double wide trailer instead of a single wide

The only time I'm not free is if they lock me up. This is a free country and I ask no one if I can do something before I do it. I run my own business and you can too. No one sets my pay or tells me when to work. But I keep seeing people comment on not being free. With every freedom you get there is a chance and a challenge. Being free is not safe or protected. I choose to take that chance and face those challenges. When you choose to work for someone else you rent your freedom to them. That is a choice you make willingly. I did it myself for years before I was willing to face the challenge. Bring down big business with small businesses. I would like to see public schools required to teach children how to run a business. I see it as a needed class to face the real world.

the tea party types remind me of the police tearing down the tents in "Hooverville" tent settlements during the depression. Typical repub reaction after leading the country into poverty beat the poor to show them how "incorrect" they are living in tents after the banks foreclosed on their homes..............Republicans are the party of intolerance and lack compassion

People don't know what a Hooverville is, and there are few to remember McArthur having his men fix bayonets and attacking American citizens in our nations capital.

I remember Hooterville on Petticoat Junction.

Gee Martine - if all the Liberals are at the OWS camps, then there are far fewer Liberals than the Liberal Media claims. Thanks for making it easier to ignore these fools!

I am so tired of the Dems crying about how the Repubs are big bad meanies. Look to your own dearhearts. The primary funding for the DNC, Dem candidates & OWS come from big business. "What?!??" you cry in disbelief. Unions = big business. Soros = big business. Hollywood = big business. Banks (yes banks) = big business. And all of these groups donate BIG TIME to DNC/Dem. Who are the richest people in government -- wait for it -- the DEMOCRATS! Kerry, Kennedys, Pelosi, etc etc. And to bring up Hoovervilles? Really? The situation was entirely different & it wasn't just the Repubs that demanded the Hoovervilles be disbanded. All of Congress & most of the towns where these camps sprung up cried for them to be disbanded. That's why the WPA was started. The minions of Hoovervilles, though there were many employed families, were unemployed men that caused alot of damage & raised crime levels in those areas. OWS are illegally trepassing on public & private property. No permits as required by local laws. And the local constabulary gave them 2 months to speak their peace & move along. It accomplished nothing other than making it harder for the 50% of the 99% to carry on their lives. Your movement can & probably needs to move ahead. But find candidates local, state, federal that will speak up for you. If you can't find a way to do this you will fade away. j u s t f a d e a w a y...................

Willowbrook,

I could say the same to you, you do not speak for everyone with an IQ higher then 75. 125 personally here and I have supported OWS from day one. I am not as petty and ridiculous as to let the actions of maybe 20 people within the movement as big as OWS sway my opinions; I am not that shallow, but perhaps you and others are.

You may be singing a different tune when we enter the next great depression because the income disparity hits critical mass. The wealthy can only get wealthy so long before there is no more wealth to obtain. When this happens a depression is going to happen because no one has any more money to spend.

During depressions the wealth is redistributed to its natural state and the process begins again. This is what Capitalism is truly about, cycles of prosperity and decline.

.

Geowil - so sorry to burst your bubble, but you too have missed the point...That being OWS have accomplished nothing other than to trespass, destroy property, keep others from pursuing their livelihood and costing the local taxpayers millions in police overtime and to clean up after them. What has that accomplished amongst their many vague opinions? If anything, they've brought more Americans against them by what they've done. Have they changed anything (good or bad) on Wall Street? No. Have they changed one thing in Washington? No. You can support OWS, that is your right, but considering all the negative things they've done so far, is THAT what you are supporting? Their ideas have not solidified, nor have they come up with one thing that will improve our current economy, actually, they want to make it worse.

OWS is the product of raising a generation of entitled, "no one can lose" kids. (By a left leaning educational community.) Real life is not like that. No matter what ideas they have, someone else, (people like me) are paying for it. Just because they don't see it, keeps them from having a true understanding of the negative impact their ideas have on the taxpayers of the US.

I had the opportunity to hear a wonderful idea that I believe would make all the difference in the world. If everyone had to write the checks to pay all their taxes themselves, (just for 6 months) rather than by payroll deduction, they would have a much better idea just HOW MUCH the govt. is taking from them. Then everyone would be asking what they are doing with THAT MUCH MONEY???!? When you look at the truth of that answer, then you will see why OWS are accomplishing nothing. They want more govt., which is absolutley what we don't need.

So, with an IQ of 125, why don't you see that?

Willow,

because I am ignoring what they are doing and focusing more on what they are saying. What they are advocating for is not something that should be ignored; to see Wall Street reigned in.

They want the law to be carried out like it should have been in 2009/10 when we learned that the banks did all of this knowing that it was going to end bad eventually. They want to know why the wealth disparity in this country continues to grow rampantly. They want money out of politics period and to put corporations back in their place as non-persons.

Some of the stuff they are asking for is complete crap, like $25/h wages for everyone. You do not get that kind of cheese without extensive education/experience. While forgiving student loan debts is a little on the high side of crazy it highlights an important fact that college costs have been increasing in a nonsensical pattern for years. Opening our borders with impunity would not be a very smart thing to do, however we also should not close them entirely either.

I do not buy into the entitlement argument as a means to discredit all opinions of the movement, but I do agree that some of what they said does show some entitlementism (even a word? If not I call royalties xD ) but that should not cause anyone to paint everything they say with the same brush.

I examine each statement that comes out of OWS on its own, ignoring the others that have come before or after. If you go in thinking, "oh more entitlement BS" then that is what you are going to see regardless of the actual content of the statement.

A few facts that OWS has either brought to attention or reminded the populace of:

1. No bank or credit rating agency employees or executives have, as of this posting, been arrested for gaming the system.

2. S&P has not faced a hearing panel on why it packaged and rated the crap loans with a triple A rating, or in other words rated as secure in repayment as Treasury bonds.

3. The wealth disparity is quickly raising toward levels that played a part in triggering the 1930's depression.

4. A reminder that money still rules in politics.

OWS is a symptom of our economic situation and our lack of leadership in Congress, Government in general, and the White House. Not all of these areas have as much blame as others but they are all part of the problem in regards to stoking unrest.

The thing that has done in OWS, besides some focusing on specific and singular derogatory events, in many eyes is that they intentionally left their message open to interpretation. Not many can understand why they would not give them a clear message and instead of trying to understand, some just took the easy root and said, "well obviously they don't have one".

OWS is very unfocused. It may never have been meant to be a true political movement. The one thing they managed to do within the country and Government was to change the conversation to why our Congress seemingly cannot cooperate and for people to start asking the important questions, some of which I listed above in the end of paragraph 1.

Whether OWS can reform into a cohesive political movement I don't know, they certainly cannot do it at present due to how open they are presenting themselves.

OWS is not gone just yet though, I think they have resigned that they cannot last out the winter and are just going into hibernation for the time being.

We live in interesting times, no doubt about that.

Geowil - you have brought up some interesting points....why can't the OWS do this? But I will have to say, the answer to points number 1 and 2 is because the govt. has changed the rules so that there is no law broken. The govt. gave Wall Street the ability to do what they've done, they can't be tried for something that is not against the law when they did it. As for number 3, there has always been wealth disparity, yet, OWS only chooses to look only at those who work for "greedy corporations." What about insanely wealthy Actors? They have been totally ignored by OWS. Could it be because Actors belong to Unions? And since the Unions are leading the OWS, the Actors get a pass? You can't tell me there is something wrong with working for 3-4 months and getting $3 million. Is this not excessive? What about insanely rich Sports figures? Their money is just as, if not more excessive, yet they get a pass to by OWS too. Once again, Sports figures belong to the Union. As long as OWS focuses solely on corporations, and not the big picture, their message will be ignored as most can see they are paying favorites, not being comprehensive. As for the Depression - it was far more devastating when people made a run on the banks, than wealth disparity. We had an idiot suggest the very same thing recently on the floor of Congress, fortunately, enough still remember the effect this had the first time and didn't follow his words. Will totally agree with you on number 4, money does, for the most part, rule politics. But once again, as far as OWS are concerned, only business is supplying the money. That is not true either, Unions have sunk more money than corps, yet not a peep out of OWS. I don't have a first problem with taking the money out, as long as it is business and Unions, if one goes, so must the other.

I find it interesting that you would overlook the laws they've broken and the money that has been wasted on them for the points you've listed above. I can't share that opinion, waste is waste, broken laws are broken laws, their message doesn't justify their actions, or make it something that should be over looked. Turning our cities into squatters camps have achieved nothing, even the Media has grown tired of them when blogs like this are overwhelmingly against their actions.

Thanks for sharing.....

The thing I find most disturbing..is not all the healthy debating I see and read in these posts, but the press blackout that's been so prevalent since the whole OWS thing began. There is much more going on around this great country relative to the OWS movement. People are pissed at the unprecendented GAP between classes. It's about the total lack of opportunity that used to make this country what it was. That's why the peeps are basically so pissed. OWS has merit.

Press blackout??? The press has fueled this movement. Go home OWS people. You do NOT represent the majority of Americans!

Introduction from a post of Old_Doc #7.2 - Tue Dec 6, 2011 11:40 AM EST - [for the 1% here]
[ The french revolution tells us that] when a society becomes divided into an aristocracy and commoners, historically the aristocracy seldom sees trouble coming and never seems to understand that their greed is the driving force. Only when their "head is in the guillotine" do they seem to want to compromise, which is of course much too late. We are currently at a tipping point in this country where the aristocracy [the 1% or 2%] has begun demonizing workers, teachers, civil servants, students and the poor. The unemployment rate for returning veterans [well trained for killing] currently exceeds 12%. I suggest you discourage your peers [and yourself] from comments like "Let them eat cake", --- know what I mean?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THE “GREAT AMERICAN NIGHTMARE” ---- 9/28/2011
The Economic disaster that is now hitting the US and most of the World is a necessary step for mankind's Noetic-evolution. --- Why? --- I just read, at newswine, that 93% of Americans still believe in “The Great American Dream”. If you are one of those believers you must first be convinced by a painful “US Economical Cataclysm” (and great VIOLENCE) that it cannot be realized, because it is an “extreme case” of a duality and must turn into “The Great American Nightmare” instead . However, if you are in the other 7% bracket you are innocent and will only become “collateral damage” with the same result. --- Sorry about that.
Just say after me: Eli Eli Lama Sabachani?----- My God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?
--- Don’t know if I can explain this to you in this short post, but let me try. Consider how this “Dream” got started in the first place. Most immigrants from Europe were “poor peasants” all being subject to the mercy of their powerful Land Barons and the Government suporting those. What lured these peasants to America was a good chance to become land owners themselves and also as rich and powerful as their previous suppressors; basically reversing their status. It’s a complete role reversal and if one side of this duality is considered evil, so is the other. To day, this wishful dream-process has become true for only 1% or 2% of all Americans, namely for the Millionaire stockholders and their CEOs, who are now saying:”Let them eat cake” to all the rest of us who are again being the “suppressed peasants” of old times. We have “recreated” these old times by clinging to our dream-like illusion.

BODHISATTVA (by Dick Suthpen).
The silence is broken by the s-s-wish of the Samurai sword severing illusions - and it rolls across the floor leaving a bloody trail of -- ~--~~-^_~~ -- ~--~~-^_~~ truth

Please share with everyone how Hitler used class warfare in the Nationalization of Germany in the late 1920's and 1930's. I think people will be alarmed how very similar they parallel The POTUS and his Party re-election platform.

And Hank Jr. was scoffed at.

I don't think that was Hank Williams, Jr.'s point. His point was that there was no chance of agreement between Mr. Boehner and President Obama.

I think the OWS movement needs to rethink what it's doing.

yellahammer!! America by design and its origin has exercised class warfare evident in civil war, slavery,catholicisml civil rights movement, the womans movement,the great dreppresion and our not so great present depression ....what blows my mind are gun toting hicks who relate to the 2% and identify with there problems (none) and denounce the current president who has been the most middle class friendly politician since FDR who created the middle class with unprecedented government action.

Harry winters2... The great American Dream only says that the opportunity exists to achieve it, not that everyone will or even want to. It is also the result of our Constitution and the republic it is based on to support it. Think of this, in a true democracy, the majority rules and those in the minority will be subjected to their whims with little to no legal recourse.

Violence you say, perhaps, but only because the populace realizes that the powers that be over the years has consistantly told us what WE wanted to hear and not what WE needed to hear. After all politicians of either side only look as far ahead as the next election.

We (the American people as Republicans, Democrats and independents) need to promote a constitutional amendment banning all non governmental financing of elections.

That should be something the overwhelming majority of us can agree on.

Protest in DC by all means, but this problem is happening at all levels of our government, and is literally being paid for by these huge multinational corporations.

This can't be done without the American public coming together, put our other differences aside. The effort can't be led by politicians because their political opponents would then be funded by the corporations.

OWS and the Tea party started partly as a reaction to the corruption the current corporate election system has wrought . The reason the Banks not only were bailed out, but the reason they needed to be bailed out was because the banks have been able to rewrite the rules they do business under.

The reason we can spend trillions on wars, but only millions on cancer research, or education, or infrastructure or anything that would benefit those of us here at home, is because military contractors and oil companies (who don't want to spend their own money on security in risky nations) spend taxpayer money on electing people who will keep certain conflicts going that stand to improve their bottom lines.

Conservatives, liberals, and moderates are all being screwed by this problem.

First of all YellaHammer, your Hitler reference shows your ignorance of History, Hitler was in bed with the rich industrialists. Secondly the rich have, and always will, win they have the money to buy the polticians, and now thanks to the Roberts Supreme Court their Corparations have the same rights as a HUMAN BEINGS. America is not a true Democracy and never has been.

YellaHammer America is close to facism, like Hitler's Germany, but it is coming from the rich elite Corporatists and their police goon squads who have broken up Occupy Protests, not the Occupy Movement, with peaceful citizens demonstating against economic injustice.

Your 'Hope and Change' is what has brought on these protests.

Stop blaiming successfull people for your being poor from your lazy lifestyle. if you sit around all day drinking smoking buying all the latest gadgets paying child support getting divorced from cheating on your spouse and taking out a 3rd mortgage on your home, it just means YOURE BAD WITH MONEY. Its not everyone elses fault that you suck at finances. So go get a job and stop being a fool.

Brent c - sorry, your argument falls flat in that what you are referencing is based more on past human ideas and philosophy developed over time far longer than the United States existance.

Interesting on your comments on obama being the great supporter of the middle class and FDR's role as well. Sorry, again you have the erroniously tried to connect the dots. The industrial revolution created the middle class, prior to that most Americans were self employed or self sufficient.

As for obama, consider this...

It has been repeatably proven by IRS and other governmental data that the wealthy can't bail us out economically. Look at the analysis many have made on what the bush tax cuts have cost over ten years, $800 billion for the top 2% vs about $2.5 TRILLION for the 98%. Then look at what % that the various income groups contribute to our income tax revenues. Look it up, the bottom 50% of wage earners contribute less than 3% of income taxes collected. Just do a search based on "who pays taxes", lots of links.

Obama is playing for votes and is using the vast numbers of the middle class in his attempt to acheive re-election. Simple human nature says that most individuals today would want to see someone else pick up the tab. The wealthy are the most obvious with their discretionary income size. Amazing that he and you still cling to the old political adage that "deficits don't matter". Keep that thinking up and it won't be long before America has no hope of meeting fiscal responsibilities other than a very few.

Better to let the obama (bush) tax cuts expire accross the board and cut seriously back on spending as well. Easier to take a little pain now than a catastrophic pain latter.

Interesting that obama also likes to take numerous campaign trips promoting his own agenda and policies as well as denigrating the opposition rather than stay in the beltway to govern and promote unity and moving forward.

can't Say Much for FREEDOM these Days..to do that, i maybe arrested & Cruxified, tarred & feathered, if U know what i mean..i've found, Law & Order comes with a PRICE..and OMG they'll TRY to Break US ALL with just That..JUSTICE !!! is JUST-US, meaning them ONLY..i smell a RAT !!! A VERY BIG RAT !!!....

Jesse G...ROTFLMAO! What part of history don't you understand.... The part where the treaty of verseilles put the onus of paying for WWl on the backs of the losers? You know "might makes right". How about the resulting socio-economic parts of this same policy that gave the german people little to no hope of improving their life. Think the well off industrialists weren't also feeling the strain?

Fundamentally, hitler first got the germans to believe that they were wronged by the treaty and that past history said that they were better. IE he motivated, unified and gave them hope. Once in a position of political power he gave the industrialist the means to rebuild germany first with civil projects then with military projects with the end result of giving a sense of prosperity and natioanl identity back to the german people. The next step came about with political consolidation. His chief competition came from the communist party, so hitler started a campaign of disinformation and fear mongering against them. Once the communists were denutted he used the same tactics on the jews and others to promote his ideology, etc, etc, etc untill war broke out.

In general and greatly simplified in details this is what happened. My sources include conversations with my father, books on the rise and fall of the thierd reich and the history channel.
BTW - obama has a modified plan of this.

i know, Like being stabbed, twisting the knife in ya..and All the time, the perpetrators are saying, this WON"T HURT !!!......

YellaHammer -- The way fascism works is to suppress free speech with nonsensical excuses like "public safety" and "trespassing." So run along and Sieg Heil! to the far-right Tea Party extremists, and don't forget to pack heat while you're at it.

american-2051576 -- Stop parroting talking points from FOX Noise.

"This country succeeds when everyone gets a fair shot, when everyone does their fair share and when everyone plays by the same rules," Mr. Obama said in an address that sought to tie his economic differences with Republicans into an overarching message.

Where is it said that he or the Dems are "socialists" (or communists) who favor entitlement "hand-outs?" I don't see how you get such lies from the statement above.

Logic-2973782 -- Your 'Hope and Change' is what has brought on these protests. Stop blaiming successfull people for your being poor from your lazy lifestyle.

Wow, just wow. Hey where are the jobs from the "successful people?" Anyone who believes that making rich people richer will somehow make you richer, is f#$%&d in the head. Really, how does that work? When the middle class is prosperous, that's when everyone prospers including rich people--this has been proved repeatedly in history.

If anyone is waging class warfare it has been the Republicans, with Gingrich back at it advocating that poor kids should be school janitors. How about all you right-wing Haters in here step up and put your kids to work "to learn the dignity of working" instead of playing video games? Yeh, let's see that.

The most recent study on the Tea Party shows self-identified members are white and in their 40s on up--primarily older citizens. These Teabaggers believe their Social Security and Medicare benefits should not be taken away because they have worked and paid their "dues." But somehow workers getting unemployment insurance, or food stamps during this Great Recession is going to people who have not paid their dues (though of course they have--you can't receive UI unless you've been working and lost your job due to no fault of your own, and a lot of food stamps are being used by military families), and heaven forbid we give Pell Grants to those damn kids who haven't paid any dues yet.

If you don't protect everyone's freedoms and rights, your rights will be next to go. If you don't invest in everyone in the nation, the entire nation loses. The nightmare of every man, woman, and child for his or herself is an ugly and destructive vision.

Go Occupy!

yellahammer. I am afraid that it is the GOP that is using Class warfare not the POTUS. It is the GOP who panders to the people, but work only for the 1%. It is the GOP who sign a pledge with Grover Norquist not to raise taxes on the 1%. It is the GOP who is working for the Koch Brother. It is the POTUS who is actually working for We, the people. It is the POTUS that is upholding the Constitution. The GOP is the cause and effect of this class warfare.

Tis the season... I highly recommend conservatives watch It's A Wonderful Life, and A Christmas Carol.

George Bailey represents the 99% and the American Dream, and Potter represents the 1% supported by Teapublicans. This movie came out in 1946, yet is just as relevant today.

Scrooge represents Big Business (most recently American Airlines bankruptcy to break commitments to their employees so they can amass more wealth to the top), and Teapublican union-busting, wanting to end labor laws, minimum wage, and the whole Race to the Bottom kind of thinking in regard to the labor force in the US. And no health insurance for Tiny Tim!

I was homeless for awhile. It came as a result of being injured on the job and getting screwed by my employer and the insurance company. It took two years of working as many jobs as I could do and living in a tent or in my car but I finally made it out and into a home. I am not a drug addict. I probably am an alcoholic but that was not the cause of my troubles. I could have gone back to live with my parents but pride kept me from doing that. Also my mother loves me so much she still wants to tell me what to wear at 49 years old.

The place to occupy is Washington D.C.. Politicians don't want to tell us what we need to hear. The USA is broke and printing more money is only making things worse. We cannot afford Social Security or medicare. Those are nice ideas but we don't have the money. Time to look in the mirror and understand it is up to all of us to get up early and work late. Save money and pay off the credit cards. Stop spending money we do not have.

The next 20 years or so is going to test us. When the going gets tough, the tough get going. I don't want other peoples money and I am not jealous of rich people.

The bankers that got bailed out and then took huge bonus money probably should be made to give the money back or jailed.

Term limits and a balanced budget amendment are long overdue. I'll have green tea please.

Good ass post Skillife, only one on here that makes sense!

Skilife,

You are absolutely right, these protesters need to be in Washington and they need a leader and a spokesperson who can convey their message in a clear and direct manner. The crooks are in Washington, they all have contributed to the mess we are in. It is time to start trimming the fat. I congratulate you on your success. Life is tough and we are all responsible for our own failures and our successes.

I looked at the protesters in Atlanta. I was not reminded at all of the homeless or poverty issues. What I saw HERE were a bunch of lazy people who are mad THEY can't lounge around in wealth. In many interviews taped in Woodruf Park most people DID NOT EVEN KNOW WHAT THE PROTEST WAS ABOUT! It was a block party atmosphere. Not wanting to be reminded of the homeless issue? I was homeless, for years, until I fought my way back. These people aren't going to change anything. Nothing will change until we put REAL PEOPLE in charge instead of lawyers. All these people are accomplishing now is destroying parks that are the only natural beauty city folk get to enjoy.

WAKE UP PEOPLE. Look to where real change is made...from INSIDE the system.

Nor am I a drug addict or alcoholic wilman and I am homeless. I am disabled, seriously so, and have never taken a dime from the government I found a way to survive in Brazil for ten years instead, until this economic situation destroyed that. And I fought until the bitter end paying my bills and starving as I watched men who'd had much more money and experience than I ever had go broke, move from mansions into small apartments or leave the business for what they hoped would be greener pastures. I came back because I figured if I was going to starve or have to live in the streets I would rather do it in my own country.

I’ve been to OWS-NY and nor are the majority of those people drug addicts or alcoholics wilman they are “working-class heroes” and small business owners like myself who do whatever it takes to support themselves and their families who come to the protest after work or on their days off. Skilife is right however; the place to occupy is Washington on the doorsteps of those who have allowed this situation to reach the point that it has. And the only way we are ever going to change it is politically because; that’s how any change is ultimately going to be achieved. Skilife is also right in saying that it is “Time to look in the mirror and understand it is up to all of us to get up early and work late. Save money and pay off the credit cards. Stop spending money we do not have.” I might also add to take an active part in the political process and key hold those we elect accountable for their actions.

But you just continue to sit behind your computer and spew vile vitriol which is all that I am sure you ever will do wilman. I am preparing to travel to another state where I have work perhaps only for a short time but work just the same and along the way I may stop in Washington and many other cities where “working-class heroes” and small business owners are making their opinions known to give a little encouragement. Someday though your paradigm may change willman and then you will know what it is like, life has a funny way of doing that especially when we point at others in a situation and degrade them.

wilman, I would ask you the call on your inner resources but for the fact that a) your comment shows you don't have any and b) I doubt that you know what the phrase "inner resources" means.

Do you have any idea what percentage of the "homeless drug addicts and alcoholics" are American veterans?

Your post disgusts me.

No worries, guys....wilman is prob just some 11 year old who got access to his mom's computer. and a dumb 11 y/o at that.

Everyone on here is a part of the 99%. Most are just not familiar with how the system works, and are like crabs in a barrel, pulling down any one that tries to escape or change because they don't have the balls to do it themselves. In all probability, no one here is going to ever be a part of that 1%, but that doesn't stop them from protecting the corporate welfare system we have where billionaires profits are private but their losses are socialized. They've been propagandized to the point where they can't believe their lying eyes.

They have protestors like the OWS people to thank for an 8 hr work day, weekends off, child labor laws, women's suffrage, the civil rights movement, environmentalism, etc. People like them are willing to take the risks that make our society more civilized.

We have real problems in this country and the 1% has been practicing a devastating class warfare for the last 30 years. People are fed up, and those that aren't need to educate themselves.

Yes jp-653910, they are saying:"let them eat cake" and have to face the consequences!

------------------------ the guillotine ------------------------------------

jp-653910, great post!!

Zighaur, if 11-year-olds are that cynical and jaded, we truly are doomed. I fear that was an adult.

Trust2112 you have Blasphemed! By using the words Fox news and Jesus in the same sentence dang! now Ive blasphemed we all know Fox news was born in the cauldrons of Hellfire, and released to decieve the massses to lead them away from the teachings of our Lord who owned no property, loved all, and on occassion or two, shut down wallstreet as it functioned in the temple.

I think you mean MSNBC

He should begin by tossing the money lenders out fo the temple (Washington) first.

"There is no one in this country who got rich on their own. No body. You built a factory out there- good for you. But I want to be clear. You moved your goods to market on the road the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for.

You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory. Now look. You built a factory and it turned into something terrific or a great idea-God bless! Keep a big hunk of it.

But part of the underlying social contract is you take a big hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along." ........Elizabeth Warren

I read China just decided to invest 83 billion and up grade their crowd control force to harness their potential protesters before they get started...Boston and other cities here look like that's their plan too....Wonder how that's going to work out for the 1% that stand against the 99% and has to hire the 99% to fight and protect the interest of the 1% to get that done?

I think you'll find that your '99%' is a very, very much smaller number.

Consider this math mmac. 90 out of 100 American Citizens (that's 90% for those publicly educated ) own firearms. At some point people are going to get a belly full. And the Police BETTER have a plan in place, because it's not going to be a "fair" fight with I-Phones and bongs.

Yes YellaHammer!

---- Has any major political change EVER happened without VIOLENCE? -----

Unemployment is now over 15%, (real total, over 40 Million?) and it will soon out number the National Guard and the regular Army --- and these will not shoot at their own families and other civilians anyways --- ( Only the, totally out numbered, “Police” might do so initially, (but will be hunted down by street Gangs in the end)

If nothing is being done by the Federal Government to help the 45% of American families that are now close to starving and freezing to death this winter, the US union will break-up and the Federal politicians will try to flee the country. The ones who are a little late for that will be hung on the many tall street lamps circling the Washington Beltway. It’s an ancient tradition of the Roman Empire, but then they had to use tall trees on the streets leading to Rome. (What a great photo opportunity for the news media?) The “States” will then be run by Street and Country-gangs, which you might have to join to feed your family. (Buy some more ammunition for your gun, if you can spare the money.) Most of the readers here have never seen REAL violence, which is apparently needed to bring about any significant Change and Justice for our country.

By-the-way, --- your i-phone or other cell-phone will long have stopped working, because it depends on our country still having an infrastructure. (Cell-phone companies.)

I'm locked and loaded Harry. Hows YOUR winter garden doing??

The 1% that own the media are hoping it will go away if they detract folks....but too many are one layoff (regardless of training or loyality to their job) or one major illness away from living in a box, much less a tent, to allow that detractor success anymore.....We've been detracted for years and we are wising up....The next thing the media will do if detraction doesn't work, is they will paint Occupy as all socialist, communist and nit wits and hope to scare people off from them. That's a hard sell for global college grads with masters degrees working in coffee shops. First goes the job or the health, then goes the house and the stuff....in comes the stress without end, out goes many families that were barely holding on to each other and other support systems. Left are those with nothing to lose and everything to gain by uniting their efforts.....the 99%. That's a strong number! Peaceful is the best way to make the change so the 1% would be wise not to take that peaceful offer off the table. When those teabags wake up they are going to be a mean, mad bunch when they realise they were used to shoot holes in their own feet.

mmac:

Who are the 1%? I never see mentioned just who these people and corporations are that seem to be bound and determined to make your life miserable. I would suspect that a large majority of them are not concerned about your complaints, but trying to make enough of a profit to stay in business. You do realize you are talking about small business owners who create most jobs these days, since the large companies have been forced out by excess regulation and taxes.

Truthfully, you flea baggers are the 1%, or much less.

Wally, you choose not to see. Many times I have read comments that try to explain that this country is very close to going under. At this point the only thing that seems to be voiceing the alarm is OWS. Those of the 99% that choose not to hear or see will be the most shocked when the !% takes your world away. Hope you wake up and choose to listen. My thoughts and prayers are with you OWS. GO OWS

justsaying1043, Wally-1853299, mmac-290274

From a post of Old_Doc #7.2 - Tue Dec 6, 2011 11:40 AM EST - [for the 1% here]
[ The french revolution tells us that] when a society becomes divided into an aristocracy and commoners, historically the aristocracy seldom sees trouble coming and never seems to understand that their greed is the driving force. Only when their "head is in the guillotine" do they seem to want to compromise, which is of course much too late. We are currently at a tipping point in this country where the aristocracy [the 1% or 2%] has begun demonizing workers, teachers, civil servants, students and the poor. The unemployment rate for returning veterans [well trained for killing] currently exceeds 12%. I suggest you discourage your peers [and yourself] from comments like "Let them eat cake", --- know what I mean?

Amin, brother!

JustSaying: I don't know what point your post is trying to make. "Many times I have read comments that try to explain this country is very close to going under".

That is undisputable. The reckless financial policies of the US Government, its out of control spending, its "money for nothing" approach has placed us all firmly in the rollercoaster ride to bankrupcy. There is no mystery in spending more money than you have and financial demise.

It is ashame that 99% explains the people on these news groups who spout "red" or "blue" political agendas without thinking for themselves. Each side (and the others who get little to no publicity) have good ideas with the goal of keeping our country afloat or moving us ahead. To mention that "The Tea Baggers" have been spouting fiscal responsibility since their inception will only garner me several rabid posts from those who mean well but know nothing. Just "Tea Bag" will set them off. They are hopeless and I fear, I have begun to think our country is as well. When all people can see is red or blue, with complete disregard for right or wrong, well...

I am no financial genius but I can tell you, the folks making the decisions don't appear to be either. How we can 'spend our way out of debt' is beyond me. It doesn't work in my check book and it won't work for our country. There is no magic that can save us. We need to have a balanced budget, it's that simple.

Social Security, as nice an idea as it is, is fiscally impossible. That is fact. Especially when they admit people into the program to absorb its benefits who have paid little or nothing into it (immigrants). I've paid 100's of thousands of dollars into it and I doubt I will see a dime when I retire. Rick Perry was quite correct exclaiming it as a Ponzi scheme. It is. If you doubt that, look up the definition of Ponzi scheme. I did. He's right.

Furthermore, the OWS movement, although noble is misguided. Their rage is misdirected. Their rage should be aimed where the responsibility lies for this mess. Congress and the POTUS. Not just this one but IMHO, the last 100 yrs. But let's just talk about one instance.

The collapse of the economy as a result of the housing bubble is not because of the bankers/lenders. The housing debacle is the result of the POTUS and Congress, specifically Bill Clinton, Barney Frank and Dodd. Bill Clinton furthered the Community Re-Investment Act. This act provided legal sanction, a methodology for the bankers/lenders to 'prey' upon the public. Who can blame them for using the tools provided to them to get rich? That's America. The CRA provided the impetitus to provide credit/loans to people who could not afford the houses they qualified for under loan programs with "State Income/Stated Asset". In otherwords, You just told a loan officer you were a rcok star who made 3 mil a year, were paid in cash and couldn't show W2's, etc. and kept it all off shore so you couldn't show bank statements to prove any of this. AND YOU WERE APPROVED. People gambled that they could buy a house at 250K on an interest only loan, as a Burger King employee. They gambled that the value would continue to rise and they could sell it for 400K before they actually had to start paying the loan off.

Although I support the discontent with how things are, to blame businesses or people for wanting to gain the American dream (legally) is ill founded. The responsibility for our mess, IMHO, lies squarely in Washington, D.C. I'd love to see a march on our capital with thousands and thousands of people carrying brooms to sweep the garbage out of there.

Again, IMHO the time has come to remove the tax breaks and thousands of pages of tax code that the wealthy can use via accountants that the average man cannot afford. A flat tax is required. No loop holes, no discounts. No one escapes. If you make 20K a year you pay the same percent of your pay as someone who makes 2 mil. We all use these systems/resources. All should pay.

I've said enough and I don't want to have all those ready to have their head explode from holding back their rage because I said "Tea Bag". lol

TEA BAG TEA BAG TEA BAG TEA BAG

Ever hear of social responsibility

Just because you don't listen doesn't mean they arent saying something. Just because they disagree with you, you don't hear them... Your mind is closed. The OWS has changed the conversation in this country. There is legislation being forwarded right now because they stood up...There are none so blind as those who will not see... And for you OWS bashers all you do is bash, you don't add anything to the conversation at all. You are a waste of space.

tim: After all that, you still didn't tell us what you/they want. LOL

Don't worry, we now have Jeffrey Immelt to fix it all!

AN OPEN LETTER TO “JEFFREY IMMELT”, THE MAN IN CHARGE OF THE FAILING US-ECONOMY!
Since you accepted this position from the President month ago no one has heard from you again, why? --- Where are you? – Are you in Hawaii creating “the massage capital of the world,” --- I hope not, because the US Economy is now totally in shambles! --- None of us 99% -ers has heard anything from you about this or seen even an outline for a rescue-plan for what needs to be done! --- What do we 99% have to do Jeffrey to get your attention? The American people (all of them, not just your GE stockholder) have a right to hear from the person who was given the power and responsibility to restore our economy and to restore the fate of our people. “Larry Summers” never did his job or took responsibility. He just made Millions for himself by giving speeches to Industry. --- Damn him, --- are you made of the same stuff? – Maybe not, at least the President thought you to be more a man of action to get “things” done. Your fame, Jeffrey, is based on being the best 20th century Capitalistic CEO, but that is a quality which will not save our country, and instead will ruin it. As I said in the next chapter on an economic solution: “putting a famous CEO (Jeffrey Immelt) in charge of the US economy is like:
-- “putting a fox in charge of the hen house”. -- It’s a death-sentence for our country --
Why is that? ------ Because your thinking and your actions have been honed to perfection inside the “Box of 20th century Capitalism” which has certainly benefited GE and please your stockholders, but you can you run an American Corporations without a country to base them on? Trouble is that nothing in that “20th century economic box” can save our country in a 21st century Global economy. The US Hyper-Capitalism must perish the same as Soviet Communism has done years ago. Basically that is what all these World-wide 99% OWS demonstrations are all about. (Don’t blame the OWS demonstrators for not knowing this, because neither do you!

You need help from University Professors who have thought and written about this NEW kind of GLOBAL economy. (Peter Morici and Joseph Stiglitz come to mind, but there must be others.)

What needs to be done (yesterday) is to generate and publish a good rescue-plan for two reasons. First, for “Plausible Deniability”; showing that it wasn’t you who failed, because any such workable plan will certainly be instantly rejected by the Washington politicians. --- Where is your workable PLAN Jeffrey? --- Second, a good workable plan will give our “People “hope” in a time when “Marshal-law” needs to be declared to prevent massive mayhem across the country. The 99% of Americans want to hear about your Rescue PLAN Jeffrey. Without such plan, you have no alibi to avoid the BLAME in the eyes of the general public for letting our country be run into the ground. You accepted this job from the President Jeffrey: --- Now Do it --- Damn it!
In another post I will present a workable plan which was generated from ideas of two people. One part is from the work of Professor A.N. Christensen at the “Harvard Business School”, the other from my own work as “Member of Technical Staff” with Bell Laboratories. I worked on it for “10 engineering men years” (on my own). --- Unfortunately, both of us have a terminal illness, --- cancer for Christensen and heart failure for me. (It’s YOU who will have to do most of the work.)

AN OPEN LETTER TO “JEFFREY IMMELT”, THE MAN IN CHARGE OF THE FAILING US-ECONOMY!
Since you accepted this position from the President month ago no one has heard from you again, why? --- Where are you? – Are you in Hawaii creating “the massage capital of the world,” --- I hope not, because the US Economy is now totally in shambles! --- None of us 99% -ers has heard anything from you about this or seen even an outline for a rescue-plan for what needs to be done! --- What do we 99% have to do Jeffrey to get your attention? The American people (all of them, not just your GE stockholder) have a right to hear from the person who was given the power and responsibility to restore our economy and to restore the fate of our people. “Larry Summers” never did his job or took responsibility. He just made Millions for himself by giving speeches to Industry. --- Damn him, --- are you made of the same stuff? – Maybe not, at least the President thought you to be more a man of action to get “things” done. Your fame, Jeffrey, is based on being the best 20th century Capitalistic CEO, but that is a quality which will not save our country, and instead will ruin it. As I said in the next chapter on an economic solution: “putting a famous CEO (Jeffrey Immelt) in charge of the US economy is like:
-- “putting a fox in charge of the hen house”. -- It’s a death-sentence for our country --

Brought to you by Halliburton, .......Vaseline is extra.

That is simply not true, you are very confused.

Did you mention the fact that Republicans have also received the same monies for security?

TAMPA — It's official: Tampa will get $50 million in federal money to cover security costs for next year's Republican National Convention.

President Barack Obama on Friday signed a wide-ranging appropriations bill that contains the money, as well as another $50 million for the Democratic convention in Charlotte, N.C.

The funds will allow Tampa officials to bring in 3,000 to 4,000 more law enforcement officers and buy or lease surveillance cameras to monitor downtown crowds and protests during the convention, scheduled for Aug. 27-30. The event is expected to draw 50,000 people, including 10,000 to 15,000 demonstrators.

A. C. is famous for his one sided troll postings for the Tea Party types...................simple answers for simple minds is the easy way to indentify a Tea Party member

ren---- are you saying: "Let them eat cake"? do you know what a guillotine is?

Flash Bang Pop Pop!

Good speech, it wont accomplish anything, but you should use your speech talents and get a job working for Obama, then maybe he wouldnt sound like a idiot so much! Great expectations for you!

"...then maybe he wouldn't sound like an idiot so much..." Really? That is the sentence structure you use to call someone else an idiot? That is priceless....thanks for the laugh.....so much.

Obama haters are just haters...they don't count. Ignorance and fear...

So what of the 47% of the population who pay no income taxes??

And the 50 million plus with free housing, free health care, free eye care, free dental care, free food, free education and free cell phones?? Why the Hell should they protest??....

The "99%" you speak of is dis-ingenuous.

I am a teacher and work with youth that will produce media. They are the reason I follow these efforts and have become an activist for media and food and water issues. These young folks can make a difference I hope as they keep their eyes open more and more to seek wise decisions. Cell phone takeover of several countries is opening their eyes to the power of media and what it can mean for social change and democracy. I wasn't on Obama team the first time...Didn't really think he'd stand up to the big business at all really...but he has turned out to be a bit thorny for them and done better than I expected with his small steps for change. Might be on his team this time...but he's was right when he was first elected and said it wasn't about him....most were not voting for him ....They were voting to change things and we need a serious discussion about how to adjust to a world full of people who are being replaced globally now with robot, lean manufacturing and huge mega farms that hire fewer workers now that they can just poison away bugs and weeds in mass and do the work of many with one piece of farm equipment. And we really don't need to wait for confirmation from scientist on whether the environment is healthy or not if we can't drink straight from natures springs and and water sources or even from the rain safely anymore do we? I'm proud so many young folks and even older folks are starting to have these conversations....Occupy wall street is about getting people to just take a look and start thinking. Wealth and work distribution is the big question and the other question is how do we keep the planet and it's living creatures healthy is the other? Both questions are intimately connected.

Tim, I don't hate Obama. I just think he's a lousy president.

Well, the only time we hear about these vermin is when they get arrested. Some movement.

And why do you think that is Wally...DUH!!! Ignorance IS bliss I guess.

Tired-numbers

A protest movement? The media reports that the largest OWS "protest" numbered only around 5,000 or so, I"m here to tell ya, in the '60's we put hundreds of thousands on the street on a weekly basis for over five years.

What a protest, a little squeak and whine for a few weeks then go home for the winter. (besides we never really got a clear idea of what you were protesting)

"They like it when people have to grovel and beg for work"

So you think job offers should come to you out of the blue? This is a prime example of an entitlement mentality.

You aren't owed anything, Tired. Get off your butt and solve your problems yourself.

Get off your high horse. I have had 2 job openings for over 2 months now, for a job that starts at $12.00 an hour and goes up depending on experience. Now I know that there are qualified people out there that want to work, but apparently not in the Tahoe area. Applicants coming in in worn jeans and tee shirts, most can't pass the drug test. Have had 4 fail it and 7 others leave the interview saying "oh, you drug test?". I have had more than a few applicants put an outrageous salary wanted on the application, so that way they know we will not hire them, but they can say "I looked for work this week" so that 99 weeks of unemployment won't run out. I do not expect anyone to grovel and beg for work, as you so blatantly put it, but hey, when you come to an interview, clean up, fill out the application correctly, don't be hung over. Right now, with as many people that are out of work, I can be picky about who I hire, the competition is tough, so don't expect anything to just be handed to you, just because you are out of work.

Why did they stop the protests again? Because ciities are tired of having their property destroyed, not taken care of, sexual harrasement, hell, they even found a dead guy at one of the camps in Texas. You people have made your point. For those of you that say you have a job, go back to it. For those of you that don't, get off your lazy a___s and get a job. I am by no means a rich man, but believe me, you and your protester buddies do not represent me in no way.

All you gimmee folks are full of bull chit.

I've been looking for drug-free help for two years. Today I have two out of seven positions filled.

My help works about 5 hours a day. Then only when the weather is nice. They make over $100.00 a day. They can take off whenever they want. EASY job. NO takers.

Tiredofitall14 - so you pay less than $2,000 a month in Lake Tahoe. How much is an average mortgage there? Or average rent? Food costs? Do you think anyone supporting a family can really survive on less than $2000 a month??? You're getting unqualified applicants because you're offering pay that would only appeal to a young person still living at home with no desire to move out.

Arizona Tumbleweed - That averages out to $20 an hour but only working 5 hours a day, and then only when the weather is nice. Doesn't sound like a stable job or a livable wage. Guess you haven't had to survive in the real world for a while now.

Tiredofitall

The OWS people are the only ones Ive ever seen who consider the phrase "you want fries with that" to be a job skill.

Steve,

It matters less what the Occupy Wall Street protesters consider to be a job.

At least these brave women and men do not consider their job to be deliberately stealing and bilking the American people out of Trillions of dollars.

To many here, apparently, the massive fraud committed by Wall Street, the Banks and Corporate America is just a slight passing event in our history. I think True History will do a better job at accurately portraying this sad and pathetic economic chapter in our time than the "scholars" on this forum.

It is mind boggling that so many here think the that Occupy Wall People are a bigger problem than the theives that collapsed the U.S. economy.

This will answer your post tiredof ....

From a post of Ol_Doc --- #7.2 - Tue Dec 6, 2011 11:40 AM EST

[History tells us that] when a society becomes divided into an aristocracy and commoners, historically the aristocracy seldom sees trouble coming and never seems to understand that their greed is the driving force. Only when their "head is [allready] in the guillotine" do they seem to want to compromise, which is of course much too late. We are currently at a tipping point in this country where the aristocracy [the 1% or 2%] has begun demonizing workers, teachers, civil servants, students and the poor. The unemployment rate for returning veterans [well trained in killing] currently exceeds 12%. I suggest you discourage your peers [and yourself] from comments like "Let them eat cake", know what I mean?

Wow, a whole 12/hr in Tahoe. Do you run a McDonalds ?

jeff / thora: It's very easy to find an excuse to NOT work. Just sit on your azz, cry and suck your pot.

Were you smart enough to understand the part, that said THEY had a choice of when to work?

And the part that said OVER $100.00?

Just what is this ez job AZ Tumbleweed? I bet a there are a lot of people who would apply for it. I live in Tucson, people line up for 10 an hour here.

This notion that you can't get good help is crap. Total, unadulterated crap. You people will say anything to support your side of the aisle, it's really rather sad and pathetic.

Why do you think the govt admits unemployment is over 8 percent....(more like 15 percent in reality)?????

People are losing their homes because they cannot find work. You really think everyone is sitting around smoking dope while they lose everything they have?!?!

IF so, I submit that you are the one getting high, because I've been out there looking and it is tough. I finally found a gig for 13 an hour and I am damn glad I got it because it took me a month to pull it off and I KNOW how to get myself hired.

The OWS movement was beautiful thing. People stating their concerns in a non violent and articulate manner. But of course and true to history, the 1% didn't want to hear it. That's unfortunate, because contrary to what many on the right wing seem to think, they are not the only ones that own guns, and these protests are not going to remain non-violent indefinitely.

In fact they are violent now, but the violence has been one sided so far.

Remember what that lovable capitalist Jay Gould once said,

"I can hire one half of the working class to kill the other half."

I don't think the one percent has changed any since Gould's day. But people like Gould are so blinded by greed and arrogance that they fail to the error of their ways.

In Gould's time crackdowns on protesters were brutal and fatal, yet the people continued to protest in ever increasing numbers as well as fight back with clubs, rocks and guns..

Labor movements grew until they became unions and the Goulds and the other 1 percenters had to yield. We have been here before, and I guess we are going to have to have that fight again.

It is true what they say about those who fail to study history.

Well moo: I've hired two Tucson people. One lasted two days. The other two hours.

I offered a rent free place to live. But we don't have a circle K or even a bar. And no welfare office. We are 35 miles from town, 65 miles from wal-mart and 120 miles from a city (Tucson). City folks just don't know how to live in the country.

We don't have as many dealers here either.

The August job report said 2.2 million jobs went un-filled.

What video???

Unfortunately you are not wrong.

Check out Jesse Ventura's expose of the concentration camps and the government "information centers" if you want to get a real scare

-------- What is the SIGNIFICANCE of these Word-wide OWS demonstrations?------
Here are the Prophetic words by Tom Friedman, the famous journalist with “The New York Times” ::
“Now let me say that in English: the European Union is cracking up. The Arab world is cracking up. China’s growth model is under pressure and America’s credit-driven capitalist model has suffered a warning [major] heart attack and needs a total rethink. Recasting any one of these alone would be huge. Doing all four at once — when the world has never been more interconnected - is mind-boggling.
--- We are again present at the creation - but of what?

-------- [ Never in the history of modern man has such a global event ever happened ] -----

As for America, we’ve thrived in recent decades with a “credit-consumption-led economy”, whereby we maintained a middle class by using more steroids (easy credit, subprime mortgages and construction work) and less muscle-building (education, skill-building and innovation). It’s put us in a deep hole, and the only way to dig out now is a new, hybrid politics that mixes spending cuts, tax increases, tax reform and investments in infrastructure, education, research [innovation] and production. But that mix is not the agenda of either party. Either our two parties find a way to collaborate in the center around this new hybrid politics, or a third party is going to emerge
-------— or we’re stuck and the pain will just get worse”.

[ Of the three demanded activities, education, skill-building and innovation, –- none is financially or otherwise supported by our present Government. --- This omission is an act of National-suicide.]

You are a true "Viper", good honest name. --- It's people like YOU who are responsible for our country going down the drain. --- do you know what a guillotine is?

Introduction from a post of Old_Doc #7.2 - Tue Dec 6, 2011 11:40 AM EST - [for the 1% here]
[ The french revolution tells us that] when a society becomes divided into an aristocracy and commoners, historically the aristocracy seldom sees trouble coming and never seems to understand that their greed is the driving force. Only when their "head is in the guillotine" do they seem to want to compromise, which is of course much too late. We are currently at a tipping point in this country where the aristocracy [the 1% or 2%] has begun demonizing workers, teachers, civil servants, students and the poor. The unemployment rate for returning veterans [well trained for killing] currently exceeds 12%. I suggest you discourage your peers [and yourself] from comments like "Let them eat cake", --- know what I mean?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THE “GREAT AMERICAN NIGHTMARE” ---- 9/28/2011
The Economic disaster that is now hitting the US and most of the World is a necessary step for mankind's Noetic-evolution. --- Why? --- I just read, at newswine, that 93% of Americans still believe in “The Great American Dream”. If you are one of those believers you must first be convinced by a painful “US Economical Cataclysm” (and great VIOLENCE) that it cannot be realized, because it is an “extreme case” of a duality and must turn into “The Great American Nightmare” instead . However, if you are in the other 7% bracket you are innocent and will only become “collateral damage” with the same result. --- Sorry about that.
Just say after me: Eli Eli Lama Sabachani?----- My God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?
--- Don’t know if I can explain this to you in this short post, but let me try. Consider how this “Dream” got started in the first place. Most immigrants from Europe were “poor peasants” all being subject to the mercy of their powerful Land Barons and the Government suporting those. What lured these peasants to America was a good chance to become land owners themselves and also as rich and powerful as their previous suppressors; basically reversing their status. It’s a complete role reversal and if one side of this duality is considered evil, so is the other. To day, this wishful dream-process has become true for only 1% or 2% of all Americans, namely for the Millionaire stockholders and their CEOs, who are now saying:”Let them eat cake” to all the rest of us who are again being the “suppressed peasants” of old times. We have “recreated” these old times by clinging to our dream-like illusion.

BODHISATTVA (by Dick Suthpen).
The silence is broken by the s-s-wish of the Samurai sword severing illusions - and it rolls across the floor leaving a bloody trail of -- ~--~~-^_~~ -- ~--~~-^_~~ truth

The problem, Bob, is that you haven't offerred a better alternative than voting. It's easy to complain, it's a lot harder to make constructive criticism that has a chance of creating change for the better.

Voting is a heck of a lot better than not voting, unless you prefer kings and dictators.

That exactly what they want, they don't just want easy jobs making top dollar and free higher education, they do not want to vote for anything.

They just want it their way....... sure sounds like the 1% to me (probably .001% in reality)

I wonder how they justify protesting themselves.....

I enjoyed the comparison of liberal vs conservative. It's pretty stark, but rings true.

However, as a scientist and engineer, I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the role of humans in climate change. Your perspective on this seems to be emotional and not necessarily rational.

considering the great lakes were once, how is that pronounced??....ah, GLAH-SEE-ARES (w/ silent A)

Were the Mastodons to blame for their retreat??, or was is man breaching the land bridge????

But what the Hell do I know??....I've called them GLAYSHURES all my life.

But since you are a scientist, with all the CO2 being emitted, plant life should flourish, correct???......and with plant life, you get O2. I think the term is called METAMORANPHETAMINE or something. But I could be wrong, just like the pronunciation of Glacier.

Since I am a scientist and engineer, I know what I don't know. I'd pay attention to what the experts in climate say.

We need someone who will lead. The president is a figure head of congress and the house of representatives. Who are charged to run the country for the benefit of the people. However with so many intelligent and thoughtful public employees I do not see how we can be in our present position when we have been paying extra for outside technical, social, and economic advice from so called experts for years. The answers to problems are not politically correct, so we due nothing to change. How is voting going to change that? A solution would be to uphold the laws we already have along with common sense. Though I will not vote for the lesser of two evils I will vote. If it is only for a belief in a better tomorrow

I took the stupid test and I fall right in the middle - like MOST DEMOCRATS - I am not LIBERAL, I'm reasonable and compassionate and I have empathy for human beings over religious freaks, warmongers, and lawmakers owned by drug and insurance scam companies and the privatized prison system. But you stupid nut jobs on the far right don't leave any room for sane people, it's all either left or right. The truth is, you people on both extreems need to start thinking about the people in the middle. We are the ones who decide who wins elections and all you can come up with is a bunch of extreem nut jobs who have managed to turn congress into a useless bunch of bickering bitches.

So as a moderate, I can only think of one solution and that is to disolve this joke of a nation and disolve the union and start over with 50 contries we now call states. That would shrink the government immediately, and dosorient all those lobbyists that own our representatives. I am sick of the cost of being a supersized superpower.

YellaHammer, What your story refers to as a conservative applies to most of the American people. Both conservative and liberal. It's description of a liberal may apply to 3% of the population that I would classify as left-wing nuts. There is nothing wrong with being conservative or liberal. Most honest people will admit to being conservative on some issues and liberal on others.

There is something wrong with letting about 3% of our population, the right-wing nuts, wrestle control of your conservative Republican Party. It is still your party, not theirs. The saddest part of the story follows: Most people would angrily take back their own party. Instead, most conservatives defend their immoral occupiers out of misplaced loyalty.

That will never happen with the Democratic Party. That, my friend, is the biggest difference between a conservative and a liberal.

You people in the middle are helping to destroy this country. you don't stand for anything. You blow whichever way the wind blows. Take a stand on one side or the other. The lines are being drawn between and the dividing line is Marxism. You're either for it or against it. Choose a side. And dividing the coutnry up like that would leave us open to invasion.

rhcrest, I think you are right.

These type of people let the Comunist come to power as well as the Nazis.

No, the extremists are destroying this country. Exactly like Hitler destroyed Germany and Stalin destroyed the Soviet Union. I stand for the United States of America. What lines do you envision and which side do you stand? A nation divided among her own people or a nation united as one to support the common cause? Oops, you would call such patriotic ideals socialism. I would call your divide and conquer tactics Fascism in it's purest form.

Good for you, so refreshing to see intelligent comments, thanks.....

Not really.... he's never there. He avoids all of it by going to Hawaii, with his family, to play golf and see how much of the taxpayers' money he can spend.

Mr Harley YES also true.

Obama may not be home if or when you try to occupy the White house. However if you do / did try to do that, I am just guessing, but I doubt the secret service would have a sense of humor about it.

If I may be so bold as to quote the actor -Tommy Lee Jones

No mam, We in the Secret Service to not have a sense of humor that we are aware of!

-MIB (oK I took the liberty to use "Secret Service" instead of "FBI")

If a republican was president I am sure you would see a OWS movement in Washington. Don't wish for something, you may just get it.

They don't have the "balls" to do it!

All they would need to do is explain to the SS that they are protesting and the laws dont apply to them. Im sure the SS would be very understanding, after all, protesting trumps all laws.

Joe you are 100% spot on. BTW the word you are looking for is THEIR not THERE. Just a small aside.

Good food for thought. I have no problem with people who voice their opinions and work for change that they believe is positive, as long as they do it within the framework of the law. Once they step outside the law, they garner my disdain irrespective of the cause they support. Employers will very likely think similarly.

Every April 15th. (Tax deadline).

Try to imagine what it must be like to be a Syrian this morning. There is no comparison.

Thats why we are in the good ole USA.

Well, the good news is less than half of Americans have to pony up on April 15th for the vaseline....